Illinois House Floor Debate — May 25, 2024

"Madam Speaker, on this glorious weather Saturday that we're in Session, the Republicans, unfortunately, find that Representatives Hauter, Severin, Sosnowski, and McLaughlin are unable to attend today. They are excused." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Have all recorded themselves who wish? Mr. Clerk, please take the record. There being 106 Members answering the roll call, a quorum is present. Under the Order of Resolutions, we have House Resolution… House Joint Resolution 67, on page 9, offered by… by Representative Friess."

"Thank… thank you, Madam Speaker. House Joint Resolution 67 designates to a portion of Route 51 that runs through St. Johns near DuQuoin as Lieutenant (sic-Lance) Corporal Drew M. Uhles Memorial Highway. Marine Lance Corporal Drew Uhles of DuQuoin died from his injuries received due to an enemy action in Al Anbar Province in Iraq on September 15, 2004 and subsequently was awarded the Purple Heart. He also received numerous awards during his exemplary service to our nation, including the Combat Action Ribbon, the Rifle Marksmanship Badge, the Presidential Unit of Freedom Citation, the Good Conduct Award, the National Defense Service Medal, the Global War on Terrorism Expeditionary Medal, and two Sea Service Deployment Ribbons. I appreciate your support. Thank you." 10300113.docx 2  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Representative Friess moves for the adoption of House… House Joint Resolution 67. All in favor vote 'aye'; all opposed vote 'nay'. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 106 'ayes', 0 voting 'no', and 0 voting 'present'. And this Resolution, having received a Constitutional Majority, is hereby adopted. Mr. Clerk, Committee Reports."

"Thank you, Madam Chair. To clarify, that was 705?" Speaker Hernandez, B.: "That is correct."

"Okay, okay. Thank you, Madam Chair. This Resolution recognizes May as Lyme Disease Awareness Month. As many of you know, tick species and related pathogens are rapidly expanding geographically in Illinois in both rural and urban areas. Lyme disease is the most common tick-borne disease, but there are several other tick-borne diseases that are also an urgent public health concern, like alpha-gal, an allergy to red meat following the bite of the Lone Star tick, which is widespread now in Illinois also. Recently, the Illinois Department of Ag's public health put out a press release stating that the Asian longhorned tick is now in Illinois. This tick is… species imposes a significant threat to the ag industry. Over the years, we have made significant efforts and progress on tick data in Illinois. However, human cases are extremely underreported. CDC reports 35 to 45 thousand Lyme disease cases per year, but admits that case numbers are 10 percent… 10 times underreported. Diagnosed cases are closer to 476 thousand annually. In 2022, IDPH only recorded 239 Lyme cases. This is not even a glimpse of what's happening. The actual number of victims in Illinois are substantially higher. Cases are only counted if the person was bitten, tested positive, and diagnosed right away. If 10300113.docx 4  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 diagnosis is delayed, they will not be counted. The effects of misdiagnosed and ineffective treatment can be devastating for people affected by tick-borne diseases. If diagnosed quickly, Lyme can be fairly easy to eradicate with simply antibiotics. If undiagnosed or misdiagnosed, Lyme can lead to severe health complications. Many become completely debilitated and disabled, unable to work. Several Illinois residents diagnosed with ALS have now found out they have Lyme and are getting better with treatment. Congenital Lyme has affected many families in Illinois. The CDC is just beginning to discuss fetal transmission, and, sadly, I just recently lost someone who battled Lyme disease for several years. The mental health toll this is taking on those affected is vast. Once again, I just want to bring awareness to Lyme disease to this Body. You supported us before in our mission to help residents of your districts because it does affect every district, every county in Illinois, and many people in Illinois. So, I just want to bring your awareness to this. I like doing this annually just to bring the awareness to Lyme disease. I mentioned alpha-gal. My mom has alpha-gal, which means she cannot eat red meat. She can't go to a restaurant that serves red meat. In other words, beef for the most part. So, I would ask for an 'aye' vote on this Resolution 705. Thank you." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Representative Swanson moves for the adoption of House Resolution 705. All those in favor say 'aye'; all those opposed say 'nay'. In the opinion of the Chair, the 'ayes' have it. And the Resolution is adopted. 10300113.docx 5  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 House Resolution 706, Representative Swanson. Representative Swanson, 706."

"Thank you, Madam Chair. Once again, I… I bring this Resolution forward to… to recognize August as Spinal Muscular Atrophy Month. Spinal muscular atrophy is a terrible disease. It affects 1 out of every 100 thousand… 1 out of 11 thousand babies born with spinal… spinal muscular atrophy. One in eleven thousand babies are born with spinal muscular atrophy. It's a terrible disease. What happens the… the spinal… the nerve that connects the brain to the legs is disconnected and is not… is not able to send the message to the legs to move. So, that puts young people at risk. Representative Lilly and I worked on legislation a few years ago where, now, spinal muscular atrophy is tested at every… with the blood sample at every year of newborn babies to identify spinal muscular atrophy sooner. A young girl from my community, Longevity for Lily is her Facebook page, if you'd like to look for her and follow her. Lily Parlier has spinal muscular atrophy, and she and I spend quite a bit of time together. Just recently helped her get a wheelchair, and Lily's just the sweetest little girl you'd ever meet. The Galesburg Fire Department, we kick off their MDA Month of September by honoring and recognizing Lily at a special community event where I will present this certificate… or this Resolution to Lily and… along with the Galesburg Fire Department. So, once again, just wanted to bring attention to spinal muscular atrophy and the debilitating disease that it is. Thank you, Madam Chair." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Representative Swanson moves for the adoption of House Resolution 706. All those in favor say 10300113.docx 6  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 'aye'; all those opposed say 'nay'. In the opinion of the Chair, the 'ayes' have it. And the Resolution is adopted. House Resolution 668, offered by Representative Manley… Leader Manley."

"Thank you, Madam Chair. House Resolution 707's a… a fun Resolution. What it does, it encourages parents to read with their child, encourages grandparents to read with the child. I find it always enjoyable to read books to my three-year- old son. Most times, he knows the words, but every time he's pointing to the pictures of the tractors or the cattle or the livestock or whatever in the book. We get into far bigger discussions than reading the book, so it's always a pleasure. And I have a reading program. I like to tell the kids in my reading program that readers make leaders and encourage them to read. This designated the week of 5 May through 11 May as Read with Your Child Week, but I say, actually, every day, every week's Read with Your Child. I would ask for a 'yes' vote. Thank you." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Representative Swanson moves for the adoption of House Resolution 707. All those in favor say 'aye'; all those opposed say 'nay'. In the opinion of the Chair, the 'ayes' have it. And the Resolution is adopted. Moving in the Order of Concurrence, on page 9, we have HB5596, Representative Benton. Representative Benton is recognized."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?" Speaker Hernandez, B.: "He indicates he will."

"Thank you. Representative, thank you for bringing the Bill forward. Could you just briefly explain the change that the Senate made?"

"And that Amendment passed the Senate unanimously. Is that correct?"

"Thank you." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Representative Benton to close."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Mr. Clerk, please read the Bill."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. This is a constituent initiative Bill regarding a Mold Remediation Registration Act. And if this starts to sound familiar, it should because Representative Syed had House Bill 4476, which was the mirror image of this Senate Bill. This provides that the Department of Public Health shall establish a public awareness campaign to assist the public in understanding the threat and importance of removing mold from indoor environments. And although it says 'shall' and it is a mandate, the department has said this is within their regular course of business. There is no appropriation required and no extra expenditure to promote this. So, it passed in the Senate unanimously. It passed the House under House Bill 4476 by a vote of 88-15, and I would appreciate an 'aye' vote today. Thank you." 10300113.docx 10  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 Speaker Hernandez, B.: "The question is, 'Shall Senate Bill 1087 pass?' All in favor vote 'aye'; all opposed vote 'nay'. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 106 voting in 'favor', 0 voting 'against', and 0 voting 'present'. And this, having received a Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. On page 9, in the Order of Concurrence, we have House Bill 5395, Representative Moeller."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?" Speaker Hernandez, B.: "She indicated she will."

"Thank you. Representative, could you describe for us the changes that were made between the version we voted on and what passed in the Senate?"

"And if you could also describe what fiscal impact this Bill will have with these changes."

"Do we know if there will be any fiscal impact to the Medicaid program?"

"First… well, I guess we should cover that piece first, I'm sorry. Beyond the current budget we're working on…"

"…what do we anticipate those costs to be?"

"I'm sorry, I wasn't clear. Beyond this year."

"And I know previously there had been an estimate that the cost to an insurer would range from $12 to $40 per member, per month. Did the changes impact that estimate?"

"Thank you." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Representative Moeller to close."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?" Speaker Hernandez, B.: "He indicates he will."

"Thank you. As you outlined, this is the junk insurance, quote-unquote, 'junk insurance,' or short-term insurance provision. See, I'm going to use your word. You… yeah…"

"Okay. Well, hopefully that's caught on some transcript somewhere. On the short-term insurance that this is banning, 10300113.docx 14  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 this was previously in the Bill we just handled on Concurrence. Is that correct?"

"And we have now… the Senate put it in House Bill 2499 with an Amendment, correct?"

"And so, I've just… for our Members, when you see our previous vote of 111 to nothing, that was on a separate matter entirely, correct?"

"And…"

"And the Senate had a 40, four-zero, to 19 vote, I believe. Does that sound accurate?"

"And this is… while the other Bill we voted on did not have opposition from the Illinois Life and Health Insurance Council, this Bill is opposed by that group?"

"Thank you." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Leader Keicher's recognized."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. To the Bill." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "To the Bill."

"I just want to make a couple of observations on this and… and make sure that everybody's aware. I… I'm afraid that people don't understand the value of why these plans are in place. These plans are here to provide a bridge, and when that bridge occurs is usually after someone leaves their job. All of you, I'm sure, have heard of situations where someone needed to get the COBRA offer from their prior employer. And what… what do you hear from them when you get that? You hear, 'Oh, my God, I've got to pay $2400 a month to protect my family? That's nuts. I can't afford to do that. I just left my job.' These plans are not junk plans. There are some that are bare bones. The vast majority of these that are sold are with good and decent limitations that provide value to our Illinois citizens and consumers in this state. A quick example that we went through. So, if you don't want the COBRA, you can either do this or you can sign up for an ACA plan. A quick comparative quote. If you signed up for one of these plans, which admittedly has a million-dollar limitation on it, you would pay for a $2 thousand deductible, $524 a month. If you went with the ACA plan, you'd get a $7400 deductible. So, almost four times as high of a deductible, and you'd pay just shy of a thousand dollars a month. That is more affordable for most families going through this situation. That ACA plan 10300113.docx 16  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 is what will devastate families, and that is the plan that will leave people shorthanded with trying to meet the deductible when the worst happens. These plans aren't perfect. They're not designed to be perfect. They are regulated by the Department of Insurance. The provisions in this policy are here because they are regulated policy. In my opinion, these do need to be modified, but modification is the key. These should be an integral part to the choice that consumers get to make in Illinois. And for my peers that believe in health care choice, as I've heard so many times since I've been here, I would urge you to preserve this health care choice for Illinoisans because it is, when most needed, the most affordable and reasonable platform that's out there. Thank you." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Leader Spain is recognized."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?" Speaker Hernandez, B.: "He indicates he will."

"Representative Morgan, thank you for being here. Can you answer a few questions? What other actions have happened in different states regarding the ban of these short-term duration policies? How many other states have implemented such a ban?"

"What are the alternatives available if these plans are eliminated? What alternatives exist for… for consumers?"

"Representative, do we know how many Illinois residents are currently utilizing this tool for short-term duration plans?"

"And… okay. To the Bill. Ladies and Gentlemen of the House, there is a reason that this piece was pulled back from the larger health care package, which I was very happy to support. And as Leader Keicher said, there's… there's just a little more work that is needed on perfecting what should be the right approach to these short-term, duration plans. There are issues with these plans, but there's further work needed in the State of Illinois to operate… operationalize our exchange. As the previous speaker was showing, we may be creating some unintended pricing pressures in different directions. So, there's a reason that this piece needs a little more work, and that is the reason I will be urging a 'no' vote." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Representative Morgan to close." 10300113.docx 19  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?" Speaker Hernandez, B.: "He indicates he will."

"Thank you. Leader, I appreciate the changes that were made to the Bill and the efforts you made to get the Bill to the point it is. I just want to highlight a few things for our side as we vote. We are changing the term 'unlawful use of weapon' to 'unlawful possession of weapon' because it's believed that better states what the actual offense is. Do I have that correct?"

"When we saw the Bill last, there were several, I believe 36, 'no' votes on our side, primarily based on the changing of the term 'armed habitual criminal' to 'persistent unlawful possession of weapons.' But the Senate changed that term, and the term would now be 'unlawful possession of a firearm by a repeat felony offender.'"

"Did… was there any conversations with the Illinois State Rifle Association about the changes in this Bill?" 10300113.docx 21  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"And… and my… my understanding is that they are supportive of these changes."

"There was another piece that initially had an objection. I believe we changed it when we saw it here in the House, but I want to make sure that it's covered. This is prospective only. There will not be any obligation for law enforcement agencies to change records going back. Is that…"

"And this Bill passed unanimously in the Senate as well?"

"All right. Thank you." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Leader Buckner to close."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?" Speaker Hernandez, B.: "She indicated she will."

"Thank you. Representative, as you mentioned, this is a small change that occurred in the Senate. I believe when this Bill came through here, our… our chamber, the vote was 64-38 to 4, and it passed the Senate 38 to 18. Is that accurate?"

"So, for our Members, I would encourage you to look at your vote on this Bill previously and vote accordingly. Thank you." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Leader Keicher is recognized."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. To the Bill." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "To the Bill."

"Folks, we need to think about data security. We've had multiple Bills that we have heard on already this General Assembly. We are taking and sharing Illinois household income 10300113.docx 23  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 data with the Treasurer's Office. Every tax filer in the State of Illinois knows that their income tax filing is going to the Internal Revenue Service and to the Illinois Department of Revenue. We are now subverting that and sharing personal income data with the Treasurer's Office. If folks want to share that data with the Treasurer, allow a process where they can share that with the Treasurer. We need to stop this continued proliferation of data just because it makes a process easier for the Treasurer's Office. If people want to be involved in these programs that he's created, then they can step in and volunteer. They can send mail to these households. But for us to continue to breach the taxpayer integrity and trust just so he can have a marketing plan into households is beyond the pail. Please step up. Please protect taxpayer data. Please make sure that we vote 'no' on this Bill. Thank you." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Representative Hirschauer to close."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?" Speaker Hernandez, B.: "She indicated she will."

"Thank you. Representative, there are a few things I'd like to go through in the… in the Bill. First, I note that there is opposition from the Illinois Bankers, and I believe their opposition is they believe that creating this investment pool with the Treasurer's Office will harm 10300113.docx 26  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 community banks by taking away potential deposits that they have. Have they expressed that opposition to you?"

"The latest Amendments place some limitations on nonprofits that can be involved in the… the pool. Is that correct?"

"The first restriction is that a nonprofit that advocates for discrimination against any categories of people who are protected under the Illinois Human Rights Act."

"Those nonprofits cannot be involved with this pool."

"Okay. So, do we… it's not defined in the Act, but 'advocate for discrimination', do those terms have their commonly understood meaning? Is that how we're to interpret them?"

"So, they… I guess that raises a question in my mind. Who will make that determination that that section is violated? Is it the Treasurer making the determination that 10300113.docx 27  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 there's a violation or will the Illinois Human Rights Act make the… or Illinois Human Rights Agency?"

"All right. So, there won't be independent determinations or investigations by the Treasurer? He's going to rely…"

"…on that? Okay. The second group of nonprofits are those that impede persons from safely accessing reproductive health care as defined by the Illinois Reproductive Health Act. That includes advocating for limitations on reproductive health care or by providing misleading information about abortion. That's number two. Is that correct?"

"So, there are groups of nonprofits. Pregnancy care centers are a group of nonprofits. They do advocate, potentially, for limitations on abortion. They would not be allowed to invest in this pool. Is that correct?"

"Who will make the determination whether these nonprofits violate Section 2?"

"So, it'll be up to the Treasurer whether this… these organizations violate Section 2 or not?"

"Well, these entities aren't investigated by anybody else. These entities are not…"

"So, it'll be solely up to the Treasurer to decide whether he believes an entity advocates for limitations on reproductive health care or by providing misleading information about abortion. Will the Treasurer be the sole determiner as to what is misleading or not?"

"We had a Bill that used similar language last year, Senate Bill 1909. Do you remember that Bill?"

"We had a similar Bill dealing with pregnancy care centers last year, Senate Bill 1909, that placed regulations and restrictions on those care centers, information they could provide to pregnant women. Do you recall that Bill?"

"And it was challenged in court, pretty soon after it was signed into law, and the Attorney General admitted in court that it was unconstitutional. The language in this Bill is very similar, if not identical, to language in that Bill. How is this constitutional?" 10300113.docx 29  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"Well, that Bill was drafted in such a way to be in compliance with the Health Care Act and the Attorney General admitted that it was unconstitutional. I believe we're about to vote on a law that our own Attorney General… it has language that our own Attorney General has agreed is unconstitutional."

"Well, we are… we are definitely setting ourselves up for a lawsuit that will have to be defended by the state. And, again, we are focusing attention on organizations that are just trying to help pregnant women and local communities who are needing and wanting assistance."

"Yes, but by including this, if they did want to, they would be excluded. So, we are discriminating against them, which we…"

"…are trying not to do under other parts of the law."

"Well, choices for some and not for others. I appreciate you answering my questions. Thank you." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Leader Keicher is recognized."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?" Speaker Hernandez, B.: "She indicated she will."

"All right, thank you. Representative, so tell me about what the intention is for prohibiting participation from non- for-profits that expends any of its funding to advocate for discrimination on any category of people who are protected under the Illinois Human Rights Act. What's the intention?"

"Okay."

"Okay. So, any student group that participated in Hamas- based anti-Palestinian protests would not be able to qualify under this. So, if they're affiliated, is what the language is that I'm reading, or supporting, advocating in any way, that would seem to exclude these pro-Palestinian protestors that are seeking the demise of the State of Israel. Is it not accurate?"

"They potentially could be, all these student groups that were on campus and this non-for-profits that are supporting them."

"So, there are many non-for-profits that are in that space that are advocating. What is your intention with the Bill?"

"And please help us understand during debate, what is that? What does that mean? So, if you have an organization, a non-for-profit that has supported these student movements on campus…"

"…they are discriminating by definition."

"They are discriminating by definition…"

"…under the Human Rights Act."

"So, an organization that supports Hamas is not discriminating?" 10300113.docx 32  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"All right. So, I think this is getting into a slippery slope because now we're also saying for organizations that are working towards religious entities that believe in pro- life that they are being denied government service. Is that your intention with this reproductive language?"

"You absolutely are. You're saying they are… 'the Treasurer shall not receive funds from.' You are denying government services to someone because of their religious beliefs. Help me understand how that's constitutional."

"It says 'shall not receive,' 'provides that the Treasurer'…"

"'…shall not receive funds from.'"

"Amendment #3."

"This is not a good piece of legislation. This is playing pandering politics where we should not be acting. And you're… in your own words, there are multiple other sources for these funds to be invested and used. You are politicizing a 10300113.docx 33  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 government process, and we should not be standing here doing that. I urge a 'no' vote. Thank you." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Representative Rosenthal is recognized."

"Thank you, Madam Chair. Will the Sponsor yield?" Speaker Hernandez, B.: "She indicated she will."

"So, the question I have, Representative… Leader, is that in committee, the Illinois Bankers Association is opposed, other local financial institutions are opposed, primarily because the… the nonprofit funds that you're talking about are deposited in these local financial institutions, and they are then used to give loans out to and support the local community, and that's the reason they're opposed. And I would encourage a 'no' vote on this. Thank you." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Representative Davidsmeyer is recognized."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. To the Bill." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "To the Bill."

"And I just… I want to reference 'cause normally on this House floor when we talk about a 'may' or a 'shall', we… we are talking about a mandate versus an opportunity to do something. In this Bill, when we say 'may', we are saying that the Treasurer may not do this. They may not. It's not that they have the option to do it, they may not do this. So, it's the same as a 'shall.' I just want to clarify that, make sure we understand that it's the fact that he does not have permission to do this. So, thank you very much, Madam Speaker." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Representative Niemerg is recognized." 10300113.docx 34  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"Thank you very much, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?" Speaker Hernandez, B.: "She indicated she will."

"Representative, we've had a very robust debate on this issue, and something during debate that caught my attention was the limitations for funding for pregnancy resource centers. Is that correct?"

"The limitation for funding for pregnancy resource centers from the Treasurer. I know we're discussing a 'may' and a 'shall', but a 'may' can be a political tool to enforce whatever the actual intent is of this Bill. So, will pregnancy resource centers not receive particular funds as a result of this?"

"So, the Treasurer's Office would have complete control over whether or not pregnancy resource centers are allocated these funds, have the complete autonomy."

"They can't?"

"Okay. So, they… they cannot supply any financial assistance to pregnancy resource centers."

"Okay. I… to the Bill. When we pass legislation such as this that seems to be a little bit confusing on this particular issue, it raises some concerns that I have, that other Representatives had… have brought up as well as the bankers, and I would urge a 'no' vote. Thank you." 10300113.docx 35  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Representative Reick is recognized."

"Sponsor yield?" Speaker Hernandez, B.: "She indicated she will."

"Let's flip this over for a bit, Representative. What happens if a… a charitable or… or a nonprofit organization that advocates for abortion puts its money in there? Can it… can it get a distribution of these funds? Can it… can it avail itself of the resources of this fund because they are in favor of abortion, advocate for and lobby for abortion?"

"Yeah, there was… that was a question. My voice went up at the end and all that kind of stuff. My… my point is, is that it has been made very plain to previous speakers that a crisis pregnancy center would not be able to avail itself of the resources of this fund. My question is, what happens of a… what happens if a non-for-profit that advocates for abortion, for any reason whatsoever, at any time whatsoever, has its money in there? I mean, can it avail itself of the benefits of this fund?"

"That cuts a wide swath, doesn't it? So, basically, I would say… and I would reiterate what the previous speaker said about difference between 'may' and 'shall' is not the same as the distinction between 'may not' and 'shall' because both are injunctions, affirmative injunctions. I would… I would advocate for a 'no' vote on this Bill. Thank you." 10300113.docx 36  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Representative Mayfield to close. Representative Mayfield to close."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?" Speaker Hernandez, B.: "She indicated she will."

"Yes, Representative, I just have two pointed questions. I asked these in committee yesterday. Currently, is there any pipelines being drilled through the Mahomet Aquifer or any carbon being sequestered underneath it?" Williams, A.: "There have been, and are currently, I believe, applications pending for the Mahomet area. So, if we do nothing here, they're pending." 10300113.docx 42  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"Thank you. To the Bill. Ladies and Gentlemen, we have to ask ourselves, why could we not get a restriction on the Mahomet Aquifer? It was mentioned that the Environmental Committee… or the environmental groups, in committee, wanted to have a restriction on this aquifer, but they could not come to an agreement. Looking at a map of the aquifer, laying over a map of the Mount Simon sequestration zone, a restriction would affect roughly 12 percent of the sequestration area. The Mahomet Aquifer supplies water to over 800 thousand Illinoisans. There are different caucuses in this chamber that always argue, 'What does this do for the Black and Brown communities? What does this do for the Latin communities? What does this do for the Asian communities?' Well, this is their water, my friends', my families', my constituents'. We tell companies all the time what they can and they cannot do. Heck, this Bill tells companies what they have to do with the carbon that they create. But we cannot tell a company that is not doing any construction or piping through the aquifer that they cannot do so. However, in this Bill, we will tell 25 percent of landowners that if they don't agree with this, too bad. Here's some money, go buy some emergency water because you may need it. The carbon sequestration started because carbon is supposedly destroying this planet, but we are going to turn around and possibly destroy the drinking water for 800 thousand citizens in this state. And the argument will be that nothing is better than something, and that when the federal government comes up with their guidelines, all will be good. This same federal government that we argued no more than three days ago failed 10300113.docx 43  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 to help the Potawatomi tribe with getting land that was promised to them. Until we can get a restriction the Mahomet Aquifer, I am going to be a 'no', and I urge you to do the same. Thank you." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Leader Hoffman is recognized."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. I would like to speak to this Bill." 10300113.docx 53  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Would you like her to yield, Sir?"

"No, I just want to talk about this Bill." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "To the Bill."

"Thank you, Madame Speaker. You know, I think that one of the things that I have done over the last 50 years is, I'm a farmer and I raise cattle. And when we're raising cattle, I raise a lot of bulls. You know, and after listening to all this stuff, my old BS meter is going ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding because what we're seeing here is a myth about climate change, about a climate crisis. We aren't having a climate crisis, but what we are having is we're having a crisis of common sense. You know, the… we went down to the Prairie State campus here last year, talked to the CEO down there. One of the questions we asked him is, why are you guys worried about capturing CO2? And he looked at me, and he shrugged his shoulders, and he said, 'I have no idea why we're capturing CO2. They just decided it was the evil element in our… in our atmosphere.' You know, and so, I think that's one of the questions that nobody's been able to answer is why are we capturing CO2? And one of the reasons why I ask that is CO2 makes up four one hundredths, four one hundredths of one percent of the global atmosphere. Doesn't amount to nothing. And, you know, as far as human beings concerned, we're… we're about three percent of that four one hundredths of one percent. So, in my little cowboy brain, that tells me that it doesn't amount to… to anything, and we're creating this whole… whole event about climate crisis, about climate change, about… and another thing that I would like to ask is, if you're going to reduce four one hundredths of one percent of 10300113.docx 54  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 CO2 in the atmosphere, what's your goal? What do you want to do? We need CO2 to grow green things. And if you keep reducing that, guess what we aren't going to grow? We aren't going to grow green things. I know earlier this week I planted 15 million carbon capturing plants to cycle CO2. You know, you want to talk about science. You want to talk about the science is that when… if you participate in sound science, your observation dictates your conclusion. Now, think about that for a minute. In sound science, your observation dictates your conclusion. You know, we have a lot of research and a lot of data we have collected on this issue over the past 70 years. You know, and we've gone from the freeze-out to acid rain to global warming to climate change. And there's one thing that I know is there's been 41 climate disasters predicted since 1967. And guess what the win-loss record for that is? Zero disasters and 41 right now. There's been zero disasters out of everything that had been predicted. You know, in 1982, Al Gore said that, you know, because the ice… because of CO2, the ice caps are going to melt and we're going to lose 25 percent of Florida. If sound science dictates your conclusion, I would conclude that 25 percent of Florida is still there and people continue to build on… on the coast. I understand that it's hard for people to get their mind wrapped around this scam that's been perpetuated on our… on Illinois and on our nation. It's much easier to fool people than to convince people that they've been fooled. And I don't expect I'm probably going to change anybody's mind today and you aren't going to change my mind because in sound science, your observation dictates your conclusion. We are not having a 10300113.docx 55  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 climate crisis, but what we are having is a crisis of common sense. And what we're doing here is we won't prevent a crisis, but we will cause a crisis by making energy completely unreliable and unaffordable for the American industry and the American people. You know, we had… we had CEJA that we did here not very long ago, the Clean Energy Jobs Act. You know, and one of the things that I've always been told was that was going to create jobs. We have a three-thousand-acre solar panel farm in my neck of the woods. And we're always talking about creating good union jobs. We're always talking about creating jobs for Black and Brown community. And I know that I visited that solar farm on several occasions, and the only Black and Brown people that were working there were from Texas and Mexico. And so, I think it's important you remember that. They make all these promises, and there's no… there's no following through on any of it. Another thing that we did was we called the IBEW when… and asked them why they weren't over there picketing on that job, and they had no answer. But there was no IBEW trucks there, there was no union jobs, there was no nothing. So, these are all shallow and misguided… misguided things. There's one thing that I know is that they're talking about injecting this CO2 into a mile, a mile-plus under the earth. You know, in other words, they're going to give the earth an enema. And so, in all enemas, there's always an explosion afterwards. And guess what? It's just a matter of time until all this blows up. Thank you, Madam Speaker." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Representative Moeller is recognized." 10300113.docx 56  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?" Speaker Hernandez, B.: "She indicated she will."

"How are you doing this morning, Representative? How's your day?" Williams, A.: "It's always great when I get to exchange pleasantries with you, Representative."

"Thank you. Can you explain to me, first of all, where the Mount Zion zone in the Illinois Basin is?" Williams, A.: "South of the Illinois River."

"So, would you say south of I-80? And I assume that most of the people on that side consider that… consider that Southern Illinois. Is that correct?" Williams, A.: "I… the… I'm hearing some disagreement with that statement. But if you're referring to the shale…"

"Yes." Williams, A.: "…that covers Illinois, the Eau Claire shale?"

"Yes." 10300113.docx 58  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 Williams, A.: "That's what we're talking about as an ideal geology, as you know, for carbon sequestration."

"And it's pretty much south of I-80." Williams, A.: "Yes."

"Correct?" Williams, A.: "Yes."

"So, would you say that's predominantly rural farm country?" Williams, A.: "Absolutely."

"Would you say also… agree that that's predominantly represented by Republican Representatives?" Williams, A.: "We have… we have a few. My friend here, Katie. Sharon Chung is weighing in."

"I agree. I said…" Williams, A.: "Carol Ammons."

"…predominantly. Predominantly. Okay. So, do you know what the status of the Hazardous Material Safety Administration revisions are?" Williams, A.: "That… those rules are in progress. There are no rules yet developed for… specifically for carbon sequestration projects, which is why we have the two-year moratorium."

"Yeah, but the two-year moratorium is only if they don't get these rules in place, correct?" Williams, A.: "If they don't put the rules in place before. Now, there is… there was, on May 15, supposed to be a deadline for the rules to be… preliminary rules to be submitted. That's been extended, I think, to June 4. But, obviously, with the 10300113.docx 59  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 significant federal investment and the tax credit program, we expect they will be done soon."

"Okay. So, I happen to sit… and I'm… I'm from Christian County, which happens to be the epicenter of where the original wells were going to be put. So, I helped coordinate a meeting with Navigator and the county board. Eighty to eighty-five percent of the landowners, residents of that area were opposed, and obviously Navigator wasn't very successful in convincing them this… this was a good project and it was a safe project. So, Navigator did an alternate pipeline route through Montgomery County, and they actually drilled a… a test well for this. The bottom line was, Christian County Farm Bureau, Montgomery County Farm Bureau, Sangamon County Farm Bureau, three years ago, were adamantly opposed to this project and nobody has convinced the local landowners that this is safe. So, the question I have, was Farm Bureau at the table for these negotiations?" Williams, A.: "We've… the negotiations have been ongoing, on and off for two years. Leader Hoffman had a Bill, actually two Bills. I've had two different Bills. And we've been getting input from all the stakeholders on these items."

"So, for the current negotiations, though, was Farm Bureau at the table? Yes, or no?" Williams, A.: "I didn't convene the negotiations. I was attending, but I did not think… I don't believe Farm Bureau was at the negotiation table."

"Did we have any Republicans, Representatives from the House or Senate?" 10300113.docx 60  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 Williams, A.: "I did not, but, you know, these Bills have been out here for some time and I can't recall any instance, except, perhaps, some casual conversation that you and I had, from any Republican inquiring about the Bill or expressing interest in carbon capture regulation, at least to me."

"Okay. Do you know how many wells we currently have in Illinois?" Williams, A.: "Total wells? All… all wells? No, I do not."

"No, carbon capture wells." Williams, A.: "There… well, ADM has on property, so that would be two I think there."

"And do you know how many wells have been… permits have been applied for, for additional wells?" Williams, A.: "I don't know that offhand. Some have been submitted, withdrawn, so I don't have a running total of that. But we're open for business."

"And so, any of those wells would require a pipeline. Is that correct? Or are they going to truck it in or use rail to provide and bring the CO2 to the well?" Williams, A.: "Well, I think… I think it depends. I mean, obviously, there's a three-part process: capture, transport, if transport is required. I don't know if they're cement facilities or ethanol plants that can be co-located with a sequestration well. Certainly, that seems possible, but I'm not… I haven't seen any business plans or proposals personally."

"So, what I would say and recommend, because my friends and neighbors who are farmers, who are represented by the Farm Bureau, and are the ones that need to be educated because 10300113.docx 61  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 there's… nobody's convinced them that it's safe or that it's a good project, until Farm Bureau has been involved in the negotiations or the Republicans have been involved in the negotiations, I'd… I'd recommend in the future that they be considered. Similar to the budget process, I think that we need to have Republicans involved. So, thank you." Williams, A.: "Thank you." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Representative Mayfield is recognized."

"Thank you. Will the Sponsor yield, please?" Speaker Hernandez, B.: "She indicated she will."

"Thank you very much. You know, I was on that committee, a study committee on the Mahomet Aquifer, or a observer back in 2014, 2015. My predecessor, Representative Mitchell, asked me to sit in on those hearings. And I'm… I'm a little, I guess, concerned at one of the previous speakers, who was very, very involved, is willing to let… let this go, let this… support this Bill, who I believe will endanger the Mahomet Aquifer. Once you breach that aquifer, once you breach the bottom of that aquifer and something happens, there's… there's no way to go back. There's absolutely no way to go back and fix that. And I know, Representative Williams, you know, this is an important Bill for you. And I… I would like to propose a couple of things that I think might bring you more bipartisan support, some things that might or should be included or, you know, done to bring some more people along. And if you don't mind, first… first thing that I would say is that we… we ought to lower the fee. You know, you've… you've accepted or set a fee of $31 a ton to sequester. What… how does that fee compare to Indiana, our neighbor?" Williams, A.: "Well, our… our fee is 31 cents for a ton of carbon stored, and it is broken down to a number of areas. I've heard 10300113.docx 63  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 in committee yesterday that Indiana's lower, but I would make the argument that our… we're dealing with much more robust, significant safeguards and protections here in Illinois. We have an extra permit requirement that other states don't have. I would argue that Illinois residents deserve the highest protection, the strongest safeguards. And if you want, I can give you a breakdown of where that fee will go. But, obviously, for the administration of the funds and the permits required and all the work that goes in to keeping these safe and making sure all the, you know, i's are dotted and the t's are crossed, there's also a… funds will go to the Long-Term Trust Fund. And that's what I think Representative Ammons mentioned, that after 30 years, there's a trust fund established. So, if a company goes out of business and is no longer able to address any concerns that may arise or any liability issues, that money goes into the fund. So, that's really important to us. Additionally, some of the funds goes to the emergency preparedness to go directly to first responders in those communities, training preparation, et cetera. We also have a component that goes to environmental justice grant funds, and this is not limited to sites where there is carbon stored. This is any EJ community for help with positive, sustainable action. So, we felt that the fee was the right amount to make sure Illinoisans were protected and still fund these important components of this process."

"Well, I think there's a difference of opinion. And I think that by not being competitive, and… and I presume that other states that look at this are going to be a lot less than Illinois. There are things in that… in that fund that 10300113.docx 64  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 are, I think, worthwhile if we're going to do this. But I think it's also very extravagant, and… and I would suggest that if you paired that fee down, it would be, I think, more… more palatable. I think the other… another suggestion that I would have, had we been able to participate in… in this negotiations, we talk about the eminent domain the part of this that goes towards eminent domain, which you know is a big sticking point for many, many of us. And one of the… one of the concerns is the use of eminent domain, and how that goes forward. But if I were to suggest a change, when you talk about the 75 percent threshold to have acceptance, and then you go to the other 25 percent that don’t, we have that, that they have… they're forced to go through an arbitration process. In that arbitration process is the upfront payment, the bonus payments that have been predominantly used in other environmental issues. Is that considered in the, I guess, the eminent domain process?" Williams, A.: "Before I answer that specific question, just to kind of clarify, the eminent domain laws that exist right now and apply to pipelines, no matter what kind of pipelines they are, have been unchanged. So, for pipelines, eminent domain is indeed the process. Highways, everything for public use, that's separate."

"I… I understand that." Williams, A.: "Yeah. This…"

"But what we have seen in the past is that a developer will frontload. In other words, they will offer an incentive to a landowner to accept their project. And then the rest of the people that haven't gone along are subject to a hearing, 10300113.docx 65  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 to an eminent domain process, where we… we try to reach an agreement. But that eminent domain process, to get to an equitable payment to keep somebody from holding out and trying to game the system, but it doesn't include that upfront payment in consideration of what that average or mean payment is." Williams, A.: "Well, let me clarify that a little bit. First of all, we're not talking about eminent domain if we're not talking about the pipelines. What we're talking about here that you're referring to is the pore space that lies deep underground…"

"Right." Williams, A.: "…where the carbon is stored, as you know, and does not deal with surface rights at all. So, I have looked at the actual language of the Bill after hearing from you guys in committee. And what… how it works is if there's 75 percent of the owners of… 75 percent of the land, the associated owners agree, then the process can move forward. It's called unitization. It's like an easement. It's not eminent domain. The ownership is retained of that pore space from the landowner. And the… they call them nonconsenting landowners, then utilize a process through DNR where they will, as you mentioned, have a hearing, go in front of a… an ALJ or and administrative hearing officer, and the determination will be made based on a number of factors. So, while the average is not calculated using an upfront payment, which is an incentive to get you to sign up early, the just compensation includes fair market value considerations, changes to your land value, if any. It's a floor too. The average is just a floor. So, 10300113.docx 66  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 the average is calculated based on the past year of payments, and then the hearing officer can hear any evidence you chose to provide. So…"

"I understand that." Williams, A.: "…if… if, in the hypothetical situation, someone decided to abuse the process, frontload all the payments and don't make any ongoing payments, the nonconforming landowners or nonconsenting landowners could go to the administrator and say, 'This is… is being frontloaded. We want just compensation throughout the process.' And it would be considered. There is discretion. So, I don't see that concern as really being valid."

"But if… I understand discretion, but we're talking about what's in the Bill that could become law. And I think it would be better for this Bill if that discretion was removed and the upload payment was absolute. That would be absolutely considered in those negotiations. Let's talk about another…" Williams, A.: "Sure."

"The Mahomet Aquifer, we've said it and done it and said it again, and I think it would make this Bill much better had we agreed to protect the Mahomet Aquifer. I think that that is a huge sticking point. It should be a huge sticking point with every Member in… and a consideration of every Member in this Body. And… and I… I understand it wasn't because there's some permits that are out there, or people are applying for permits, and the labor unions felt that it would inhibit some work that they might get. But I… I believe, firmly believe, and I've heard it from others, that once you 10300113.docx 67  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 permeate the aquifer, once you go through it and something happens, there's no going back. One last point, and… and that's the moratorium. You know, we have, actually, and you mentioned it, a… a company that's proposing to sequester out of Gibson City. And it's a short pipeline. It's a short pipeline. And I would suggest, rather than… than interfering with that process that's ongoing, that perhaps the moratorium should only affect pipelines over, say, 10 miles. You know, this is not about people bringing pipelines in from other states or… or shipping, you know, making a pipeline run the length from Waukegan to Central Illinois. I… I think it would be much better if you would exempt pipeline, short pipelines, like the one ADM has, like the one that they're proposing in Gibson City. Give… don't interfere with that already permitting process. They're already working. They want to sequester the carbon. They want to do this project, but we're putting a moratorium on them. We're putting restraints on them that I think are going to interfere with doing what you want. I mean, we're doing what your caucus wants, and you want to pull CO2 out of that fermentation process, out of the ethanol plant. I think it would be a good idea to let that process play out. If they can get the farmers to agree to… to sequester, they can run that pipeline and get an ICC permit, and get a Class VI well permit. I… I think this interferes with that process. And it may give us… it may give us another commercial application of this sequestration that would be very, very helpful as we go down the road as an example of how things should be done, could be done, and maybe it… it would be… it would make this process more palatable. So, those 10300113.docx 68  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 would be my suggestions. Perhaps had we been allowed to be involved in negotiations we could've dealt with this sooner. But without these safeguards, without these things, unfortunately, I can't support this Bill at this time. But I certainly appreciate your… your hard work." Williams, A.: "Thank you." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Representative Bunting."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?" Speaker Hernandez, B.: "She indicated she will."

"Super. Representative, a lot of my colleagues on this side have already answered most of the questions that I've got, but I would like to go back to the 31 cents per ton. Can you tell me what the breakdown is on… on where the percentages of that money is going?" Williams, A.: "I sure will. Okay. We have 10 percent going to the… the administration funds, which processes the permits, staffing, administration. Two percent goes into the Water Resources Fund. Six percent goes to the oil, gas, and resources management. Twenty percent goes to the emergency management and preparedness training that I mentioned. Twenty-eight percent will go into that long-term trust fund, which backs up those financial assurances we spoke of. We do have a chunk going to… I don't see the number here, to the environmental justice grants, as well as a small percentage to GRF."

"I've got it here that 24 percent goes to an Environmental Justice Grant Fund. Can you explain exactly… as Representative Caulkins had said there before, if you look over in Indiana, I think they're right at seven cents. When 10300113.docx 69  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 we look at this, 24 percent of 31, we're… we're roughly 8 cents. Can you explain to me exactly where that funding of the environmental justice grant fund, where that money will go?" Williams, A.: "Well, sure. The reason for that, the inclusion of that line, was a lot of the plants were talking about the applications, these industrial applications, cement plants, they're located in EJ communities. So, what we're done throughout our efforts to decarbonize is make sure that the communities that are most impacted also derive some benefit from our efforts and are able to participate as we move to a cleaner and greener economy and… and deal with sustainability and decarbonization on all levels. So, this is not inconsistent in what we've done in CEJA and what we hope to do as we decarbonize buildings and as we go towards dealing with vehicle emissions, et cetera, and that is to make sure that those communities have some opportunity to make forward movement for themselves too."

"Okay. I'm… I'm glad you brought that up with… with community. So, this is absolutely, without a question, in my district, rural Illinois, a hot button issue. We have got folks that… that push both sides of this, and they're extremely passionate about what they feel about carbon sequestration. As you had said earlier with Representative Rosenthal, that rural Illinois is going to be the receiver of much of this carbon sequestration. Can you tell me where the beginning is going to take place and how… how is this carbon going to get from point A to point B?" 10300113.docx 70  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 Williams, A.: "Well, that's the transport piece. So, again, the process is a three-part process. First is capture, then it is the transport, could be a pipeline, most likely a pipeline, and then it's sequestered in an injection well. I would argue landowners have the right to utilize their property for a well, just like they might for a windmill or a solar farm or any other application. So, there's landowner rights conversation kind of on both sides of the issue. The implication of landowner rights is limited to, for nonconsenting landowners, is limited to the pore space, which is about a mile underground, I think, if I recall the science correctly."

"I… I understand the pore space part… piece of this, the actual sequestration. Where… where is this carbon? Where are these plants at that are causing the carbon to be sequestered?" Williams, A.: "Well, this is any… any plant, an ethanol plant, a refinery, a cement plant, an asphalt plant, manufacturing facilities throughout the State of Illinois. So, when you… you know, certainly the wells and the carbon are sequestered in a rural areas because that's where the shale is and it needs to go under the shale, but the plants are everywhere in Illinois. So, I would argue this doesn't just impact rural Illinoisans, but it takes carbon… significantly reduces carbon and co-pollutants in areas… all areas of the state, and that's why we're doing it."

"So, refineries up in the suburban area, the collar county areas, they're going to sequester their carbon, and 10300113.docx 71  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 they're going to put it in a pipeline and pump it down into rural Illinois. Is… is that what you're saying?" Williams, A.: "Well, it's up to those… those companies. I don't know of existing plans or business plans or the business models for those, but this is what is designed, is to keep them from emitting carbon, an opportunity collect the carbon, and keep it underground and not up into our atmosphere where it contributes to the continued and devastating impacts of the climate crisis."

"Super. So, when we talk about the placing of pipelines, it… it is all instrumental on this moratorium. Can you explain to me… I understand the piece where it's either going to be… it's either going to come from the federal government with the regulations and FEMA or it's going to come with a moratorium two years out. Can you explain to me the reason for the two-year moratorium?" Williams, A.: "Well, you got it there. The two-year moratorium is just that we don't go ahead with pipelines until there are federal rules in place. Now, you know that pipelines are governed by the Interstate Commerce Clause. We can't regulate pipelines completely. The federal government has primary responsibility for that through PHMSA, and therefore we're waiting for those rules to come down before we feel comfortable proceeding with the pipelines. If they come down sooner, then the moratorium will not continue for the full duration."

"Sure." Williams, A.: "But… but one extra step, as I've mentioned throughout my presentation, we do go far above and beyond the 10300113.docx 72  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 federal requirements. So, there is also a component of this Bill that allows for the ICC to have a process to regulate pipeline safety and… and protections for landowners where the federal government does not. So, where there are regulatory gaps, we are mandating the ICC to fill those in."

"I am all for landowner's rights. So, now that you've brought that up, let's have a conversation about the non- participating landowners in rural Illinois. Are they protected in this?" Williams, A.: "Well, the term is the nonconsenting landowners, and the first step is for… once it is determined that it is safe and suitable to put an injection well in a particular property, the company would do modeling to determine how far the carbon would extend, and that would tell them which percentage of the landowners they need to contact about the potential project. So, of that group of landowners that they identify as being impacted by the stored carbon, they need to get at least 75 percent, which is the highest number, or equal to the highest number that we have in any other state, to agree to move forward. It could be 99 percent. It could be 80 percent, but minimum of 75 percent. At that point, if they move forward, the process then goes to the DNR. And it is not an eminent domain process. It is about that pore space below the surface. It cannot be used for putting a well on. You can't be required to have a well on your property. It's only for the pore space impacted under the ground. Those landowners would go to the DNR, that public hearing would be held, they would have the opportunity to present information on just compensation, fair market value, and the calculation, which 10300113.docx 73  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 would be an average, that the other Representative mentioned, is one factor that's considered when you determined what just compensation is."

"How close to a nonparticipating landowner can you place a well for carbon sequestration?" Williams, A.: "I think… I think it's 300 feet from a dwelling, and that might be pertaining to all wells."

"So, in this Bill, you can place a carbon sequestration well within 300 feet of a nonparticipating landowner?" Williams, A.: "Let me clarify that for you. Well, we can go on, and we'll come back to it when we have a more definitive answer."

"Well, that was my last question." Williams, A.: "Okay."

"I was going to go to the Bill." Williams, A.: "Please."

"So, we'll patiently wait." Williams, A.: "Okay. Actually, that may be something that is in the Class VI permitting regs that is a federal requirement under the Safe Drinking Water Act. So, that may be something that they have jurisdiction over that we do not."

"Okay, super. To the Bill. As I had stated before, this is an extremely hot topic in my district. I am pro-economic growth. I am pro-seeing this state move forward, but I am pro-public safety. We need to make sure that not just 75 percent of landowners are protected. We need to make sure all of our landowners are protected. Rural Illinois is a prime spot for carbon sequestration. I will not deny that. I have an ethanol plant in my district that is working hard and 10300113.docx 74  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 tirelessly to get a project up and rolling. They are pillars of their community. They do a fantastic job. They are an economic driver of the community in which they represent. Folks, you need to vote what your district wants you to do here. That carbon sequestration is coming to rural Illinois, but it is coming from the suburbs as well. That carbon is going to be sequestered in refineries, in other businesses, and it's going to be sent to rural Illinois, via the way of pipeline. It is extremely important that we get this right. I have been in this chamber for just over 16 months. I promise you this is going to be one of the hardest votes I have to take to date. I sat in and listened to the committee yesterday. Leader Elik brought up a great point. This stuff is coming to rural Illinois, represented by Members on my side of the aisle. I know this discussion's been taking place for two years, but all of a sudden, in the eleventh hour of the spring Session, our hair was automatically on fire. We need to slow down. We need to make sure that this is right, and we make sure that everybody that raises a family in this state has their voices heard. Vote your district. Thank you." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Representative Swanson is recognized."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Does the Sponsor yield?" Speaker Hernandez, B.: "She indicated she will."

"Thank you. Yes, once again… I'm sorry. How long has this been… how long have we been working on this did you say?" Williams, A.: "I'd say four or five years ago there was a task force Bill that was passed by former Rep., now-Senator Tom Bennett, which facilitated the study that Rep. Ammons mentioned about the… from the Prairie Research Institute. And 10300113.docx 75  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 that's where we started to look at the issue, see about safety and suitability of the technology for Illinois. Since then, I've introduced two Bills, Leader Hoffman's introduced a couple Bills as well to provide regulation. Then 20… 2022 is when the IRA passed, providing the tax credits for companies."

"And this is not an insurance Bill? So, I can throw my notes away on an insurance Bill." Williams, A.: "Sorry, can you repeat the question?"

"I can throw my notes away. It says insurance Bill…" Williams, A.: "Oh."

"…up on the top." Williams, A.: "Nope."

"You would think a Bill we've been working on four years, that we could properly identify it so the transparency and members of our communities would know what they're looking at and we're not trying to look for an insurance dental care reimbursement Bill. So, this is a hot topic, as mentioned by many, and I'm going back to what my seatmate talked about earlier with the groups involved in the discussion. You've got a great list of people I highly respect from across the… the whole spectrum. But I see there's no one on there from what… I got phone calls from Farm Bureau. I got phone calls from Illinois Soybeans Association. I've talked with the cattle associations. Do you find it helps, when putting legislation together, that you have opponents at the table also to help bring in opposing views to help make better legislation?" Williams, A.: "Well, interestingly, the Farm Bureau was very involved in the negotiations in earlier iterations of this 10300113.docx 76  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 Bill and, in fact, were proponents, if I recall, of Leader Hoffman's first two versions. My understanding is that there was a membership vote in December of last year that, based on the eminent domain piece, changed the position. I will say the Farm Bureau's been an excellent advocate for their membership and has had many dialogues with me and kept me up to speed on positions throughout the process, both with my original two Bills as well as this. So, I feel that I've heard the voices of the Farm Bureau, and we've made several Amendments and addressed several pieces of their concerns."

"And the Soybean Association?" Williams, A.: "I've had conversations with the soybean folks as well, and they were in some of the earlier negotiations. All which culminated into the agreement today."

"All culminated into the last day of Session where we have this discussion. So, we've heard a lot of discussion here, but what is the carbon goal that we want to achieve here in Illinois?" Williams, A.: "Well, the CEJA… the Bill that we passed in CEJA 2021 set our goals, and we continue to find ways to reach our decarbonization goals. We don't have a lot of time to play around. Despite the conclusions of some on the other side of the aisle, I and many colleagues here and… and actually science is supporting that position. So, CEJA dealt with the power sector primarily. We continued to work on the transportation sector, which is a huge source of carbon emissions. Buildings is under discussion, but this is a difficult to decarbonize sector, the industrial sectors. We're not about to stop needing cement, ethanol, oil, any 10300113.docx 77  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 time in the next foreseeable future. So, we need to work on decarbonizing those industries as any way we can using this tool. When technology gets to the point that we can eliminate those fossil fuels, that's great. But until then, this is a tool to get us there while we continue to find other ways to decarbonize the difficult industries."

"But you don't have a number?" Williams, A.: "Number?"

"Do you have a number of where we want to be in the metric tons? A million metric tons?" Williams, A.: "I don't have that. No, there's… it's not… it's not like that. It's not calculated by metric tons.

"Well, let me share with…" Williams, A.: "I can certainty dig up my CEJA…"

"In Illinois…" Williams, A.: "…fact sheet and let you know what we ended up with our CEJA goals, but those are more in the power sector, if that'd be helpful."

"I've… I've got those numbers." Williams, A.: "Okay, great."

"So, 1971, Illinois was at 65 million metric tons. In 1996, 60 million metric tons. And at 2021, 57 million metric tons. So, we… we have decreased the amount in our air 8 million metric tons in 50 years. So, I'm trying to understand where we want to get to. It sounds like we're on the right path now if we're trying to decrease. How much can we decrease? And the reason I bring that up, back in 1970s, we moved from the second, third order effect of things. We went from leaded fuels to unleaded fuels. And what that caused me 10300113.docx 78  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 to do, as a farmer, I have to add 70 to 90 dollars worth of sulfur into my soil. Last summer, on the 20 of June, we were facing a drought. I was calling federal legislators to try and get CRP ground released so that I could have something to feed my cows. After that, the first part of July, we had a shower of rain. Not much rain, but what came after that was all the carbon from the Canadian fires that brought… came down to Illinois. And to me, I was from a zero-bushel crop to 260-bushel-per-acre crop. Green… carbon makes green. Every green plant needs carbon. This past year, we planted 35 thousand carbon consumers, carbon users per acre of corn. We planted 150 thousand beans per acre. That's going to be a part of the photosynthesis process. And when I read the science information from many of these scientists who are a lot smarter than me as a simple farmer and soldier, they tell me that green products has a way to adjust to the carbon availability through the photosynthesis process and through the respirator process. And I guess I'll continue on the Bill with some more of my points here. Here in Illinois, as a soldier with the Illinois National Guard, we trained and monitored and were prepared in case of a earthquake from the New Madrid fault. We live on the New Madrid fault. We also live on the… oh, shoot, I lost it here in my notes. Another… or, a potential disaster area. But when we look at putting these pipelines in, it's one thing to put a gas line in at low pressure, it's another thing to put a… a CO2 line in at over 20… over 2 thousand pounds… 2800 PSI pumping through the air… through the earth. We just recently, I believe it was the 27 of March, there was an earthquake here in Illinois 10300113.docx 79  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 that majored 2.8 on the Richter scale. So, the concern is there. And when we start penetrating through water with a pipeline, that we all rely on that water as a source, it's concerning. Wabash, there, I found my notes. So, through this, I look at the winners and I look at the losers. It appears like many of the winners are those who get a percentage of the pie. As mentioned previously by one of my partners on this side of the aisle, there's no real protections for the farmer, the number one industry in Illinois. And I guess I go back to the Sponsor with this question. Is this a mandate on anyone else that has a carbon release through their company or through their industry or through their business?" Williams, A.: "No, this is an optional program."

"So, it's not a mandate, but it's optional to a big business in Chicago, but it's a mandate on the ethanol industry?" Williams, A.: "This is not a mandate. If you'd like to work with me to mandate restriction of carbon emissions anywhere, I'd be willing to talk about that. But, no, this is for… ethanol plants are primarily the plants we're talking about in Central Illinois, actually, that… that are interested in this technology. And they've… they've approached us with their… their interests, and our goal here was to make sure that we regulate. And with those federal tax credits, they're coming to Illinois."

"I guess, if I wasn't very clear, I'm an opponent to this, so I would love to work with you on any type of other CO2 work if you invite opponents to be on that part working group." 10300113.docx 80  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 Williams, A.: "I'm always open to conversation, Rep."

"Ladies and Gentlemen, this is a… a very poor start to legislation that just appeared overnight. It's been several years in the making, and here we've got Senate Bill 20… 1289 as an insurance dental care/reimbursement. Seeing it right before we are about ready to close and work on a budget, and I think it's disingenuous to bring this to us at this time of day to have this discussion and not have the ability or… ability or availability to talk with any of our constituents. I urge a 'no' vote." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Representative Halbrook is recognized."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?" Speaker Hernandez, B.: "She indicated she will."

"Thank you. Representative, I don't think we've had the opportunity to discuss or debate Bills with you, unlike the Representative seated directly behind you from Glen Ellyn. So, I'm looking forward to this. In committee Friday afternoon, the proponents that were advocating for safety and for their citizens, they'd indicated many things that they weren't able to achieve a hundred percent of or maybe even get. One of those that was the protections for the Mahomet Aquifer. But there was also a discussion, I think it was about post-injection site closure. The feds have a 10-year limitation. I think 30 years is baked into this statute. I know the proponents were looking for a hundred years. What other things did they come up short on in regards to these protections for the citizens?" Williams, A.: "Well, first of all, I would disagree with your characterization that we didn't get protections for the 10300113.docx 81  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 Mahomet Aquifer. Right now, there are no rules on the state level in place that would keep a well from being drilled through, and there would be no surrounding protections. So, as I've said from the beginning of my presentation, this is about ensuring there are protections and safeguards in place, and it is the strongest in the country. Also, the Class VI wall requirements on the federal level are specifically focused on drinking water. They stem from the Safe Drinking Water Act. So, that assessment that we're somehow endangering the aquifer is… is just simply not true. Number two, you'd asked about the hundred-year, 30-year, negotiating point. A hundred years sounds good, fine. That's… that's fine. But what we've done is it could be a hundred years, it could be 200 years. Because what we have decided on here is a 30-year post-injection site care period, at the end of which there's an assessment by the EPA which looks at the well, looks at the safety, looks at the surrounding area, determines whether they should continue with the monitoring and… and evaluation of the well beyond that 30 years. It could be many years thereafter. If it's in an area that the geography indicates there continues to be some risk no matter how low it is, the EPA can make that decision. So, I would not consider that anything that we fell short on. I actually like the idea of a risk assessment, very science-based."

"Well, I understand, and, you know, my… my follow up to that is, how can you in good conscience compromise on these things that you believe like the hundred-year, or whatever it is, post-site care, how can you compromise on those important safety factors and then compromise on the safety and security 10300113.docx 82  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 of the citizens in the region where these things may be located or across the State of Illinois?" Williams, A.: "I don't… we did not compromise on safety. We did not compromise on the science. Everything we're doing here is backed up by science. I think the danger to Illinoisans would exist if we allowed these project to move forward without safeguards in place. And that's what will happen if we don't get this Bill passed today."

"Well, I think, to this point, and I sort of have more questions and comments then Rush Limbaugh had opinions, but I'm really concerned about the long-term liability here, and I'll address that later. Moving on, in the Inflation Reduction Act, which is federal law, I believe that's kind of one of the main reasons we're here. And there's been many previous speakers talk about the reasons why we need to do this, and I can kind of argue for and against a lot of those. Can you explain to this Body how the finances in the Inflation Reduction Act, how that works in… in regard to Illinois companies that create CO2, pipeline companies, and the sequestration of that? Are those in the form of cash payments to someone? Are those in the form of tax credits? Who… what is that and who receives those things?" Williams, A.: "Well, it can be applied for by anyone that is eligible. It is a tax credit that is issued based on the ton… tonnage of carbon that you store. So, that's how it works. It's a tax credit structure."

"So, creators of CO2, are they in line for any of these incentives, whether it's cash or tax incentives? Are… are the creators of CO2, are they on that list?" 10300113.docx 83  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 Williams, A.: "What I'm referring to is the sequestration. The credit goes to a sequesterer, if that's a word."

"Okay. Next question is, are you familiar with the Keystone XL Pipeline?" Williams, A.: "Just like anybody would be from the news and…"

"Right. So, what is the reasoning or what would be your thoughts of why the administration or yourself would advocate for the closure or the… the cessation of the XL Pipeline, to shut that pipeline down, but yet we want to advocate for a different pipeline? What… what would be your reasoning or your logic to shut that down and advocate for something else?" Williams, A.: "Well, again, I will come back to the same two points that I've been making consistently. The tax credits out there, companies are taking advantage of it and will be locating here whether we like it or not. So, I would suggest that putting regulations in place is key. I would also note that, I'm guessing the pipeline you're referring to, I don't know the specifications, is fossil fuels. We are talking about a process here, a technology that removes carbon emissions. And that's something that fits in with my bigger goal and the bigger picture of addressing the climate crisis."

"Yeah, but you and I don't receive those tax credits. My constituents don't receive those tax credits. The pipe… the Keystone Pipeline, the Keystone XL Pipeline, would've brought low-cost energy. We wouldn't be paying nearly four dollars for gasoline and diesel fuel in this country today if we had the Keystone XL Pipeline. This would be real relief to everyone in this room and every one of our constituents if the Keystone Pipeline was to be put in place. That's real 10300113.docx 84  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 meaningful, important things. Next question. If the pipeline is safe to transfer… transport CO2 to sequester, why isn't it safe for enhanced oil recovery?" Williams, A.: "Well, enhanced oil recovery is a process, first of all, which generates more. It's fossil fuel intensive. It's a higher risk, sort of, process. This is just about storing the carbon underground into sandstone, in the pore space there. Enhanced oil recovery, I'm not an expert, but I believe that's where you inject the CO2 as part of a process to extract it. Other chemicals are also involved. It's higher risk process and something we were not comfortable allowing here in Illinois. This is strictly, again, a climate-positive effort to make sure there's less emissions in the air."

"So, why… again, you mentioned it's more risky for enhanced oil recovery. It's going to be the same style and a pipeline. I don't know why that's more risky for one process over the other." Williams, A.: "I'm talking about the injection wells. And the process is not just storing carbon, again, gas, liquid, eventually solid. The carbon is stored in pore space. It does not rise. It moves horizontally. Enhanced oil recovery, again I don't have a lot of detail about the process, but I know it involves pumping carbon dioxide into rocks, trying to extract oil out of it, moving it back up, using other chemicals, a lot more intensive of a process."

"Yeah. So, to your point about sequestration, I know you kind of wanted to focus on that a lot today, and that is important. And we've talked about the Mahomet Aquifer, and you believe those protections are there. I have kind of a 10300113.docx 85  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 list, and I may just read through them. And my question here about this list is, what are the protections, what are the setbacks for these types of places, if you will, places like wells, lakes, rivers, where people may get their water from? What are the setbacks from former or current oil and natural gas production fields? What are the setbacks from landfills? What are the setbacks from former or current coal mines, any other surface mining operations or rock quarries? What are the setbacks and protections to stay away from these types of things that are out there in our… in our landscape?" Williams, A.: "You mean for the injection wells to… where they're…"

"Right. Injection wells or sequestration fields." Williams, A.: "Okay."

"I mean, we have a lot of these things…" Williams, A.: "I thought you were…"

"…that you've mentioned on this list…" Williams, A.: "Okay."

"…scattered throughout the State of Illinois…" Williams, A.: "Okay. Sure."

"…so there has to be some limitation in the statute to say do not put sequestration injection wells or fields near…" Williams, A.: "Absolutely."

"…these facilities." Williams, A.: "And… and thank you for bringing that up because you actually touched on one of the benefits to this particular Bill and the way we've drafted it here. In addition to the extensive and rigorous requirements in a Class VI well… well permits that are facilitated under the Safe Drinking Water 10300113.docx 86  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 Act, our Illinois permit specifically addresses regulatory gaps. So, where the feds don't weigh in, we weigh in with the state permit for sequestration, and that deals with soil and air protections. So, as part of the permitting process, whatever kind of well you're drilling, there has to be modeling, there has to be surveys, I don't know if I'm using the right term, geological surveys, assessments as to what other infrastructure, what other wells, what else might be in that space. Seismic activity, of course, is considered as part of that assessment as to whether it's safe to put a well here. That's true of any well you would drill, any kind of structure that would go into the ground. So, it's a very extensive process, and all those items you mentioned, I believe, are considered."

"Okay. Thank you." Williams, A.: "Yep."

"Is the goal here to correlate a zero-carbon economy?" Williams, A.: "Pardon me. Can you repeat the question?"

"Is the goal of all of this to create a zero-carbon economy, a zero-carbon whatever? That we don't use carbon whatsoever?" Williams, A.: "Well, again, I think it's based on the science. I know the parameters of that could… I don't know the terminology you're referring to specifically, but I do know that science tells us that the carbon emissions that are emitted into the air are causing the climate crisis and many, many devastating impacts and costs on communities worldwide. Obviously, Illinois, we can't fix the climate crisis. We can't do everything here, but I would argue we need to do our part, 10300113.docx 87  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 while simultaneously protecting communities and the environment."

"Right. Well, so, you know, you've talked about the scientists agree, and I believe the scientists disagree, and I believe that we could probably put together a groups of scientists on both sides of this issue. But let me talk about the sciences I know it and we know it in this room. How do you respond to the fact that life as we've known it for the last 5 thousand years is carbon based, and without carbon, life ends. How do you respond to that?" Williams, A.: "I don't really know what that means. So, I'll have difficulty responding to that."

"Well, we're a carbon… carbon-based life. Everything that we do is based on carbon. And when you seek to remove all carbon, life will end. How do you respond to that? That's simple science." Williams, A.: "Okay. Well, you know, carbon exists… I'm not a scientist, but I can tell you I know the science about the contributions of carbon emission to the climate crisis, as I've said, and that's what we're talking about here. I think your question is a bit beyond the scope of the Bill today."

"Yeah, so are you a biologist by chance?" Williams, A.: "I am not."

"Okay. Thank you. Ladies and Gentlemen, to the Bill. This is a decision that we are making late in the day here, late in the weekend of a… a time that we were supposed to be adjourned or near adjourned. This is a decision that will have lasting impacts for centuries. In the last 150 years, near the end of the 19th century, or the early 20th century, 10300113.docx 88  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 many cutting-edge technologies were put into place only to find out later that they've created messes that we are currently, and for the last maybe 30, 40 years, have been trying to clean up. This is maybe cutting-edge technology today, but it's in its infancy. We do not know yet the long- term implications or ramifications from the technology. We do not know what the potential hazards may be. Let me break this down in the simplest of terms. At zero carbon, plants don't grow, animals will die, our food production system ends, life ends. You cannot be all in on the new green deal and be for the working man at the same time. At this point, how will you put… how will you have kale salads, tofu chips, avocado toast, or almond milk for your free school lunch programs? I want it on the record, Republicans are right on the science, we're right on the issue. You're all going to regret voting 'yes' for this. Vote 'no'." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Leader Hammond is recognized."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?" Speaker Hernandez, B.: "She indicated she will."

"Thank you. Representative Williams, and… and first and foremost, I appreciate all the work that you have put into this, and… and I know that you, not only today but for some time, have been very passionate. I do have some questions, if I may. This legislation includes a… a process to integrate certain landowners into a project against their will. Is that correct?" Williams, A.: "Yes. This is something that it happens with regard to many similar projects that require additional participation. So, the difference here is that it's only 10300113.docx 89  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 applicable to pore space. We've had people say they didn't even know they had pore space. But when this does come, as long as 75 percent of the land… of the land, those correlating owners, agree, then the project can go forward. Yes."

"And… and I realize we… this has happened on other projects. Eminent domain, certainly for my area, for my constituents, has always been extremely important. How are those integrated landowners, that 25 percent once the 75 percent are in, how are they compensated for their property rights?" Williams, A.: "Well, there's a process that takes place through DNR. So, it is not an eminent domain process. It goes through DNR where, once the, you know, application has been provided, once the safety assessments have been done, so it doesn't get to that point until the project looks like it could be a go, those landowners then go to DNR and then they can make a case in front of, kind of, an administrative process, where they can show evidence, bring in experts, and the experts actually are provided as well and involved in the process, to make an argument as to what the just compensation will be. There is an average that is calculated based on the payments, which doesn't include the incentive for being an early signer. But that is a floor, and so the… the compensation can be higher than that. And if the landowner still is not happy with the agreement, they can go to court and appeal it there."

"And… and so, I think you hit on a little bit of… of my next question when you said it is not the same as the early signers. So, how is that compensation different from the landowners that signed up for the project?" 10300113.docx 90  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 Williams, A.: "Well, the average is calculated and used for a floor, as I mentioned. But companies are allowed to provide like a sign-up bonus as an incentive to get the project going. And many people are happy to accept that based on pore space that lies deep within the ground they will never use, and it will not impact any surface usage."

"Which brings me to my next point, if you will. And, no, we didn't share these questions ahead of time." Williams, A.: "It's okay."

"But it's working out quite well. Thank you. So, those that are actually, and I'm going to use the word 'forced' into these projects against their will, why is certain compensation… and I'm reading from page 9 of the Bill, 'Such compensation shall exclude any incentives, such as signing bonuses, provided to the consenting pore space owners prior to the initiation of the injection.' Why is that compensation not included and not owed to the integrated landowners?" Williams, A.: "Well, I did read that same section. I discussed it with the Farm Bureau, and I understand the concern. Their concern, I believe, was that there would be an abuse of the process, that there would be an attempted frontloading of the compensation that would end up leaving the nonconsenting landowners in a worse position. We provided for the average to be a floor. So, the reason that people provide an incentive and the reason it's allowed is to allow the projects to move forward and to incentivize people to be a part of it. Many people are happy to do it. They weren't using the pore space anyways. There's really no way to use it, so they're happy to do so. If there are nonconsenting landowners, then that's 10300113.docx 91  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 absolutely fair that there may be, they can then look at this other process through DNR. It's almost like an easement. There's no change in ownership rights. If you sell the property, it runs with the sale. So, basically, this is a floor. They can make an argument as to why they should get more and what just compensation really is, like any other sort of analysis, real estate analysis, of… of what just compensation is."

"And I think for many, they look at this as the possibility that… that they could be compensated with zero dollars, unless they are willing to jump through these hoops and then perhaps even incur some legal expenses. But my last question for you, Representative, and I appreciate your time, if that land use has a fair market value and it justifies a compensation, shouldn't that compensation be considered in your Bill? And why has it been excluded? And does it, in your mind, have a value?" Williams, A.: "I'm a little confused about your question. Can you…"

"Sure." Williams, A.: "…reword or something? I'm…"

"Sure. Why… I'm… I'll try to make it as simple as I can." Williams, A.: "Please."

"Why aren't these landowners that are being integrated into the process, why aren't they also given some certainty that, since they are being forced into these projects, we appreciate the fact that your land has value and we want to compensate you for that?" Williams, A.: "I believe that…" 10300113.docx 92  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"Why are we making them go through an entirely different process?" Williams, A.: "The process for these is to ensure that they can make an argument for the maximum value and make an argument that they are entitled to just compensation. Again, it's more like an easement. It's not an eminent domain process, but I wouldn't call it jumping through hoops. We wanted to provide enough discretion for the DNR to make sure that landowners could make an argument that, hey, their upfront payment was a little higher than we've seen elsewhere, think you should take that into account when compensating me, for example. And I think we've provided the discretion in the statute to allow that. And the average is going to be calculated just, again, as I've said, as a floor. So, my intent is to ensure those nonconsenting landowners are fairly and well compensated, regardless of when they sign up for the program."

"And finally, Representative, I will just say that I think that there are very… there are very good, responsible actors in this business, and I respect them for the process that they have done in the past and I expect they will continue to do in the future. But at the end of the day, eminent domain has to be at the core of what we believe for landowners in the State of Illinois. Thank you." Williams, A.: "Thank you." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "Representative Ann Williams to close." Williams, A.: "Well, thank you for the discussion. I enjoyed hearing everyone's perspective and appreciated your advocacy for your constituents and for your communities, I really do. This has been a long time coming. I kind of forgot that we 10300113.docx 93  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 did a two-year study before we even got to the introducing the multiple Bills that we did. I want to start off by thanking Leader Hoffman. He has been an amazing partner on this and so many energy issues, and his leadership has really helped shape what I think is a really strong agreement. I have to also call out some of the members of the Governor's Office who helped us convene and facilitated the discussion. Deputy Governor Bria Scudder, Shareese Pryor, and JC Kibbey were amazing at getting very, very diverse viewpoints to come into a room, sit together, and come up with a solution we could all live with. Big thanks, of course, to my friends at the Clean Jobs Coalition team, the industry players, and those in organized labor, all who participated in the conversation. Just… just to reiterate, yet, one more time and I'll wrap. The motivation here really is twofold. This is an important tool to decarbonize the industrial sector. The climate crisis is escalating, that's what the science says. We need every tool at our disposal, and this is an important tool. Without this legislation, though, we are not protected. We have no safeguards in place. So, I would argue that if you're okay with these projects moving forward with little to no regulation, no safeguards in place, then go ahead and vote 'no'. But if you want Illinois to lead the country in terms of strong and robust safeguards for our communities and our environment, please vote 'yes'. Thank you." Speaker Hernandez, B.: "The question is, 'Shall House… Senate Bill 1289 pass?' All in favor vote 'aye'; all opposed vote 'nay'. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk, take the 10300113.docx 94  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 record. On this question, there are 78 voting in 'favor', 29 voting 'against', 0 voting 'present'. And this Bill, having received a… a Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. Mr. Clerk, committee announcements."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Republicans would request an immediate caucus in Room 118."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. To the Motion."

"I respect the changes that have been made in the Senate and the effort made by Sponsors to improve the Bill to move many of the stakeholders to neutral. The issue I have and the reason I'm not supporting it is this. Currently, the law is that if an individual does not pay a traffic ticket, their license is suspended. Of course, that creates a great incentive for a person to pay their traffic tickets. If this becomes law, an individual will get three unpaid tickets per year before they would have their license suspended. So, therefore, it's a great disincentive until you get to that third ticket to pay your tickets to the local government. I believe will… this will lead to reduced collections for local government and impact their budgets. So, I, again, respect the changes that have been made. The Bill has improved, but I just can't support the change. Thank you."

"Thank you… thank you, Madam Chair. I move to concur on Senate Amendments 1 and 2. Senate Amendment 1 adds two provisions that we chatted about on the floor. It provides that the program will be made, and this… this is the DCFS orientation Bill that… that is coming back, that we provide the orientations in person or virtually. And that if a person requests that a program be offered in a language other than English that the department or its successor will accommodate that request. And Senate Amendment 2 is language proposed by DCFS that they shall offer to host the orientations. And there is no opposition, and I ask for an 'aye' vote."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Thank you. Representative, it appears that, with the Amendment, there was some opposition in committee, primarily around the opposition from the Illinois Academy of Physician Assistants."

"Thank you for that explanation."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. To the Bill." 10300113.docx 99  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"I want to thank the Sponsor for mentioning that, that she's willing to work with us. In the original Bill, when we sent it out to the Senate, it did include the PAs. And when it came back from the Senate, it did not. And so, it's one of those deals where sometimes things get fixed in the Senate and sometimes they don't. And as the Sponsor did say, there's more… there's actually other work to be done on this, and I certainly have full faith in the Sponsor that that's going to be done in the Veto Session. So, for the 4 thousand-plus registered, certified, licensed PAs in the State of Illinois, they appreciate the chance to be included in this Bill, and for them I say thank you."

"Thank you, Madam Chair. Move to concur with Senate Amendment #1. Makes a technical change that goes to severability, which is a line in there that the House Democrats wanted and we agree with." 10300113.docx 103  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Thank you. Representative, would you just briefly describe what the change is that the Senate made?"

"And this Bill passed 69 to 29, I believe, when it came through first."

"And it appears the vote was 37 to 19 in the Senate. Thank you."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Thank you. Representative, the Amendment in the Senate, you said, makes clear that this change applies to leases or agreements executed after the effective date of this law. Is that accurate?"

"And it also, I believe, puts into this Bill what is in other statute that rental payments by cash may be made and they would avoid a fee. Is that accurate?"

"All right. And just for Members on our side, the vote previously was 64 to 39, and the vote in the Senate was 43 to 10300113.docx 107  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 12. And just have Members review their vote, 64 to 39. Thank you."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Thank you. Appreciate your description of the changes. There were a few… one of them deleting punitive damages as a remedy for the tenant."

"And also, changing the retaliation provision regarding complaining to or seeking the assistance of the news media. Is that correct?"

"And reducing the amount of damages from three months' to two months' rent, if I'm reading that correctly."

"The… and for our Members, the vote previously was 62, 42 to 2. You may want to review your vote. Thank you."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. I move to concur with Senate Amendment 1 to House Bill 5000. This language represents an agreement between myself and IDPH and Senator Syverson. And it simply defines inspection… infection control committee and an infection preventionist. And provides that a person shall not be accepted for residence at an assisted living establishment or a shared housing establishment if they 10300113.docx 110  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 require insertion, sterile irrigation, or replacement of a catheter unless they are self-administering or they have a person that is on maintenance for these routine catheter cares. And also, that it must be done in compliance with a health care professional, and requires an assisted living facility or a shared housing establishment that provides this catheter care to one or more residents to designate at least one person as an infection prevention and control professional, and adds an effective date of July 1 of 2025. Appreciate your support."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Thank you. Leader, the… other than the change you outlined, the Bill still has the provision that there is a 10300113.docx 111  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 copay prohibition for abortion and that does not apply to high-deductible health plans. Is that correct?"

"And the coverage for pregnancy, postpartum, and newborn care rendered by perinatal doulas and licensed certified professional midwives includes home births, home visits, and support for labor, abortion, or miscarriage, that remains?"

"And to Members on our side, the vote was 72 to 37. Thank you."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. I move to concur with Senate Amendment 1 to House Bill 5189. It… it does exactly what… what the Bill did coming out of here. They just didn't like how our language was written. So, it… it continues to protect the members of the Brotherhood of Locomotive Engineers and Trainmen."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Senate Amendment 1 to House Bill 5190 simply adds an immediate effective date. Appreciate your support."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Thank you. Leader, I appreciate the explanation of the Amendment and what it does. This is an agreed Amendment between the American Cancer Society and IDPH. Is that correct?"

"And the data is to be solicited from willing parties rather than data collection by the department because the department was concerned about its power to collect that data. Is that accurate?"

"It looks like when it came through the House, the vote was 100 to 6. So, to those who were 'no', I would suggest taking a look and voting accordingly. Thank you."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Thank you. Representative, appreciate you bringing the Bill forward. I'm going to go through a few of the items with the… of the Bill with you. Of course, it's an honor of mine to serve as spokesperson of Ethics & Elections. We've had numerous subject matter hearings on a lot of these topics."

"I was a little disappointed. I know it wasn't your decision, but I was disappointed this omnibus did not come back through Ethics & Elections so we could talk about the final product with a full committee, but we'll do that here on the floor. The first thing I want to discuss is the changes involving voter registration lists and voter information and how the State Board of Elections will make that available to the public, the time frame. I believe on Amendment 2 it was bottom of page 19 into page 20 and specifically what that's designed to address."

"Yes. The bottom of page 19 into page 20, it says that, 'Except during the 27 days immediately preceding any election, the State Board of Election shall make available to the public the statewide voter registration list, including redaction of,' and it lists several items of… of voter 10300113.docx 117  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 personal information. And I was just… the question is, what brought change forward? What are we addressing with that change?"

"Yes. It… specifically as it relates to the release of this data to the public who is requesting it. It says the State Board of Elections shall make this voter registration data available to the public, except during the 27 days immediately before the election. And I didn't know if there was some issue that this was designed to address."

"Are you aware of any instances where this data has been published, perhaps, in the media?"

"Okay. Let's move to… down to, it's on page 21, I believe, dealing with, let me get there myself, Electronic Registration Information Center. And I guess the question is, kind of just generally, Illinois is involved with that…"

"Which known as ERIC."

"Why are we still involved? Why… why remain with our involvement?"

"And do we have a… a feel for how much this involvement costs the state?"

"And information I've received suggests other states are moving out of ERIC. Do you know why that is? Do you have any information there?"

"Do you believe ERIC or does the State Board of Elections believe ERIC is helping us clean our voter registration rolls?"

"We've made some slight changes to the process for write-in candidates. What are those changes?"

"So, they… each person who's a write-in candidate will submit their…"

"…to the local election authority, where the… the person's name will appear on the ballot?"

"We are also making some changes regarding candidate… this is regarding campaign finance, regarding how candidate committees receive money during… or campaign funds, potentially, during the primary, and it allows for unlimited donations from the party committee to the candidate committee. Why is that change made?"

"The era before was that we didn't want party leadership to have too much control or influence with funding elections, and we want that now? Is… is that…"

"But this would allow for the…"

"Correct, to… to donate directly to the candidate committee an unlimited amount in the primary, which is only currently allowed for the general election."

"We also have some clarification on the appealing process for electoral board hearings and rulings. It appears that that is just cleanup language to make sure it's clear how that process works. Is that accurate?" 10300113.docx 120  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"We've also made a change to… it doesn't say nursing homes, but a lot of times these are nursing home voters, on how they can either… now, with this change, they can mail in the ballot or they can have the… the vote conducted at the nursing home. There has been some issues that… though there won't be poll watchers there, if these are mailed in versus the voting effort at the nursing home, there's some concern about the transparency of that process. So, the question is, why did we add that additional area?"

"And we had some discussion in committee on a… a subject matter Bill regarding polling places at park district buildings, and it appears that the final language tried to essentially meet in the middle between the… the two different opinions that were presented in committee. Could you explain how that will work now under the Bill?"

"So, in short, the park district and the election authority are to work out their differences. If they can't, the county board will… will resolve it."

"We've also changed the… slightly changed the language for a Home Rule referendum. Would you explain why that change was made?"

"So, the… sorry. So, the issue is if, by saying cease, so you'd be voting 'yes' to end it, and people may have been confused thinking they were voting 'yes' to keep it."

"We also deal with pay for townships, township supervisors. And what brought that forward?"

"And it… it appears there may be instances where incumbents were using that basically to protect their position, it… it appeared."

"And then, on Amendment 2, there was some language regarding the Department of Corrections, the Uniform Code of Corrections, and I believe that was all pulled out with an Amendment. Is that accurate?"

"So, there's no changes to the way time credit is calculated or anything regarding corrections in…"

"All right. I appreciate you answering my questions. I believe the vote in the Senate was 51 to 3, with 3 'present' votes."

"Thank you."

"Thank you. Will the Sponsor yield, please?"

"Thank you. Representative, can… can you tell me what we've done with judges? There's some reference in here to judicial vacancies. It amends the Election Code?" 10300113.docx 125  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"Okay. What is the Re-Entering Citizen Civics Education Act, and what are we going to be doing…"

"I beg your pardon?"

"So, we're not requiring Department of Corrections to hold those classes and…"

"Okay. And then with unlimited campaign contributions in the primary, does that apply to every candidate, Supreme Court judges… judges or people running for Supreme Court?"

"So, in a primary, they can receive unlimited campaign contributions?"

"From the party only."

"And who donates to the party?"

"Are there limitations on what a person can donate to the party?"

"Okay. And then I want to clarify, the cannabis growers now, because of the First Amendment, are able to contribute to political campaigns. I think you referenced some Supreme Court decision, First Amendment."

"So, a 2017 case said that we violated their First Amendment rights by not allowing them to contribute?"

"Well, I was just trying to get a clarification."

"So, what's happened over the last seven years? Our election laws said that they can't contribute but the court said they can? I mean, has it just been unenforceable and… we're… we're just cleaning up the language?"

"Thank you very much. I appreciate it."

"Thank you, Ms. Chairman. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Representative West, I'm looking at the board, and earlier today we had a very important Bill dealing with the… 10300113.docx 127  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 the Governor's health care. And the title that we saw on the board dealt with the dental industry. I'm looking at the board now, and we are dealing with an extremely important elections Bill, and I see Crohn's, I see colitis. We could add anal glands, whatever you want to add to this. It has nothing to do with what we're dealing with right here. And I understand the process, and we do these gut and replace, but when it has absolutely nothing to do with what we're discussing, it is very deceiving to the public. But in all seriousness, this is an extremely important Bill. I don't think that people should be questioning ERIC when, in fact, it is the only system that allows the states to get this information. Would you agree?"

"And just to remind the Members, before all of this happened in the original Bill, this Bill passed the House on a vote of 114 to nothing. Thank you."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Yeah, Representative West, expound a little bit upon this unlimited campaign contributions from political parties. Am I… am I reading… reading that correct, that you can have unlimited funds during a… during a campaign, if it comes from a political party?"

"Okay. So, it comes from like the Democrat Party and the Republican Party." 10300113.docx 128  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"Okay. Why… why would we do that? What's the reasoning for that?"

"I don't… that makes no sense as an explanation. In a… in a state that has been destroyed because of insane insider influence peddling and outright corruption, why in the world would we do this? That's… frankly, that's a very, very poor explanation. I mean, is… I mean, are… are you saying that, you know, there's… there's no chance that these… these political systems and these parties could be, you know, controlled by insiders that don't have the best for the State of Illinois in mind? I mean, has there been some mass conversion towards a less corrupt government?"

"Is the deep state less deep?"

"In a state that is… that has epic corruption… you know, the… the former leader of your Democrat Party, that you want to give all of this… this control, is on the brink of going to prison, we hope. He should. Why in the world would… would we be making these organizations more powerful than they already are? Were they not powerful enough before?"

"Money is power, Representative."

"Okay, that… that makes no sense. I'll… I'll go to the… to the Bill."

"Unlimited campaign contributions from existing political apparatus is only going to result in making the politically powerful even more powerful than they are right now, and that is going to come at the expense of the citizens. It always does. Corruption and influence peddling. Insider dealing. These are the things that allow the crazy policies to come out of this place that has destroyed opportunity for almost everybody in this state. Making these people more powerful is exactly the wrong direction. If this state is going to be fixed, then this stuff needs to be fixed. And, quite frankly, more people here need to be less powerful. More people here need to be challenged. More people here need to be defeated if this state's going to be fixed. And this is making that much, much less likely. This is insane. Vote 'no'."

"Yes, to the Bill."

"I agree with the previous speaker that unlimited funds in the primary, it… it really only helps the establishment, and it… it doesn't give a fair shake to newcomers. Please vote 'no'."

"Chair, point of personal privilege."

"Ladies and Gentlemen of the House, just been notified that we had somebody going through the cars over in the parking deck next to the Stratton. Some things have been taking out of some of the cars. So, if you park over there, please make sure you check your vehicle. Luckily, they caught the person and have arrested them. But this goes to my point of safety from yesterday. The Secretary of State needs to put cameras, for our safety, for your safety, for your family's safety, and anybody that visit this campus. Do it, and do it quickly. Thank you."

"Just a brief follow-up point of personal privilege to what the previous speaker said."

"So, not only did this person break into cars, they also made threats to the owner of that car. I want… I want everybody to know that this person will probably be out in a couple hours, so make sure you lock your cars now before they get out."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Thank you. Representative, do you remember the original debate we had on this?"

"Do you recall the request that we had on that?"

"Okay. And… and I bring that up just because so often we got told no because of a partisan reason, and sometimes we're offering guidance to make a process easier, smoother, and to make a better Bill for the people of Illinois. So, I like what you did here. I'm encouraging concurrence, and I'm glad we got this fixed. Thank you."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. I request a record vote on this Resolution."

"Little… little slower reflexes today, Madam Chair. Thank you. Ladies and Gentlemen of the chamber, HR763 declares June 6 and 7, 2024 as Eternal Heroes Memorial Days in memory of the Illinois Raveno Boys. On the night of June 5 and 6, 1944, more than 6,500 elite paratroopers of the 101st Airborne Division, the first of the first, spearheaded the American airborne assault on the Cotentin Peninsula in Normandy, France with the critical missions of securing four causeways leading inland from the beach codenamed 'Utah' and neutralizing enemy resistance in advance of the amphibious landings at dawn on D-Day morning by the 4th Infantry Division. Many of these paratroopers were mis-dropped from their designated drop zones. Before dawn, a small group lead by Major John P. Stopka, 502nd Parachute Infantry Regiment, attacked and captured a strategically sited and important German garrison headquarter a strongpoint at Marmion Farm on the outskirts of Ravenoville village. Major Stopka made the decision to hold the farm until relief arrived from Utah Beach, thereby denying enemy movement against the northern shoulder of the 101st assault area and the critical exits. Throughout D-Day, other mis-dropped paratroopers from the mixed elements of the 101st, and even some from the 82nd Airborne, arrived at the farm, thereby strengthening the American defense against repeated enemy counter-attacks. These elite paratroopers of the 101st and 82nd Airborne Divisions jumped into the night sky over the Cotentin Peninsula minutes after midnight on D-Day to spearhead the Allied invasion of Fortress Europe. Their mission was to free and liberate Europe. Our mission today is to honor and 10300113.docx 136  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 remember them. Please join me in recognizing the Illinois Raveno Boys for their heroic actions taken on the day the Allied forces stormed the beaches of Normandy. Thank you."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Thank you. Leader, I just have a few questions as we go through the Medicaid omnibus and want to hit those. I think some other Members will have questions as well. Somewhat in… in numerical order by article, we have a change in Article 10 regarding rate increases for psychiatric evaluations and medication monitoring performed by community mental health centers. And that… my understanding is all but one of these pieces came before the Medicaid working group, and that would've been one of the items that did come before the working group."

"That is. And what was the… the need to increase those rates? What was the policy initiative behind those?" 10300113.docx 140  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"We also have a change in Article 50 regarding DCFS payments for beyond medical necessity. We're making that change from 11… the 11th day to the 3rd day, if I'm reading that correctly. And…"

"If you could, in… what's covered in Article 150, discuss the 72-hour rule for Medicaid, the standardization of MCO utilization review practices, and what's called gold carding."

"And this is cost neutral for FY25, to be enacted in FY26. Is that correct?"

"There was some discussion in committee regarding the expansion of pharmacists' ability to test and provide medicine for certain illnesses. Would you describe what that change is?"

"And there were some questions in committee about the ability for pharmacists to be able to perform these and potential… the concerns about overall treatment for the patient. You discussed that and answered those questions in committee. If you could, for the Body, describe why that policy change is one that's being sought."

"And if you could, tell us what the estimated cost, gross cost, for the FY25 budget will be and then what the net cost will be to the state."

"We believe that HFS may have updated that number to… today to…"

"We're showing now 103.57 million, and a net cost of 52.69 million."

"Okay. Thank you."

"Thank you, Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield for a few questions?"

"Thank you. Leader Gabel, not to go back to Article 190, but to go back to Article 190, there's some concern with 10300113.docx 143  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 the provisions. This is known as the test and treat. Was this discussed in your Medicaid working group?"

"Can you tell me why not?"

"Okay. Is this a push from the pharmacist?"

"Oh, they are?"

"Okay. Well, unfortunately, Representative Hauter is not here today. He's on call, and he… he has some concerns with that and states that it is not a push from the pharmacists, in fact. Have they slipped in support?"

"In support?"

"Okay. Is there a mandate for insurance coverage for this provisions within this Bill?"

"There is not?"

"That the insurance would cover this test and treat."

"Thank you. So, as you stated, the language in the provision deals with strep throat, RSV, head lice, and you mentioned a few others when you were speaking with the previous speaker. Have you heard of this kind of language before? You've been here a little while. Has this kind of Bill come up before and failed?" 10300113.docx 144  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"Okay. Well, hopefully, if there's another speaker, possibly that has been in that Health Care Licensing, maybe they could speak to that. That would be great. Like I said, Rep. Hauter, he's… he's on call. He wanted me to really stress that the scope of practice issues in Health Care… in Health Care Licensing, and this being put into an omnibus Bill is very concerning without real debate or a chance to get stakeholders or physicians involved. Does the test and treat language included in the article apply to children under 17 or adults with preexisting?"

"But it's included in the article to apply to children under 17 and also adults with pre-existing. So, with no carveout, they would be included. Is that correct?"

"Correct. Well, if… if it's okay, Leader, I'll go ahead and… it is included in the article. It does apply to children under 17 and adults with pre-existing conditions. I'm told that that piece is concerning and that an Amendment to exempt children under the age 17 and under and adults with pre- existing could get medical groups neutral on… on this. So, knowing that their concern, obviously, is about public safety, on knowing that, would you support such an Amendment?" 10300113.docx 145  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"Okay. So, I have your word that you will consider and work…"

"Okay, and work with the chair of that committee?"

"Thank you. All right. And can I also trust that you'd be willing and able and push IDFPR to ensure that the proper training and safety standards are in place to entrust patient safety?"

"Yeah. Yeah, and this is where it goes back to Representative Hauter's concern about the… the scope of practice issues in health care. But I also have some concerns putting anything more on IDFPR because if they're not even able to handle figuring out how to take payments online, I'm real concerned that they're going to be able to handle the safety of children under 17 and adults with pre-existing conditions. Thank you. That's all."

"Thank you. To the Bill."

"The 190, I realize that Representative Morgan and Leader Gabel have offered to make sure that we look into this further, especially in Health Care Licensing. I… I just wanted to express, along with Dr. Hauter, when I see a patient that comes in with eye pain, not unlike someone that's coming in with a sore throat, the average person does not know where to look for that eye pain. That's why I went to many years of school, Hauter the same thing. We question whether or not the 10300113.docx 149  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 pharmacist, although great in pharmacy, are they really qualified to do some of these things? I believe they need to be looked into. Just as our Leader McCombie said, we need to look a little bit further. I don't… I don't think that we absolutely have to rush in to that particular part. But if we can come back with some Amendments, if we could come back to Health Care Licensing, where it, I think, should've been in the first place, it's… it's not something that should be taken very lightly. It's something that is really, really important, and it's for the health and well-being of this… the State of Illinois and the people of Illinois. I… I really want you to think about what you vote on that today. There's so many other good things in there, I just wish we could do line item. But I appreciate… thank you, Speaker, and we'll just leave it at that. Thank you."

"Thank you, Madam Chair. To the Bill."

"First and foremost, I want to thank Leader Gabel for her leadership on this. When… when Senator Gillespie took her 10300113.docx 152  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 new position at the Department of Insurance, Leader Gabel stepped up, and we really didn't miss a beat. And what we have before us today is not a perfect Bill. You know, I would question whether, except for maybe some of mine, if we have any perfect Bills that go through this chamber. And it… so, it's not a perfect Bill. There… there is always work to be done, but I think we heard earlier, when Leader McCombie was speaking with Leader Gabel, that she is, in fact, willing to look at possible changes and… and see what can be done. But we have arrived at a point where we have been able to put a package together that helps our hospitals. It helps our long- term care industry. It has funding for mental health, per diems for staffing in our nursing homes, some help with the real estate taxes on some of our nursing homes that are struggling. This has been a Bill that has taken yeoman's work to put together, but I especially want to thank our support team, Taylor Howard and Lauren Hund, and all of the rest of our team that have been behind you through this. Thank you, ladies. Thank you very much."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Leader Gabel, we all know that serving on the Medicaid Working Group is yeoman's work. How many different meetings did we convene throughout this spring, do you recall, at 7 a.m. every Thursday morning?"

"So, these conversations have been ongoing and extensive. And we talked a little bit about this in committee. I… I don't 10300113.docx 153  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 remember how many different individual Bills were presented, perhaps you do, and what the… the total… if we accepted every single request, many of them very, very noble, very important, but we would rack up quite a list here. Is that correct?"

"Right. Right. Well, it just shows you the important of… of this work and the value of a… of a collaborative bipartisan process, and I want to thank you for that. I'll speak now to the Bill."

"Ladies and Gentlemen of the House, the Medicaid working group is a process that works. It… it certainly is working this year. And even though we've heard, and… and I know that this has created some pause for Members of the House, that there was one item that was a surprise item added into… to this package, and that's not the fault of the Medicaid working group. That's related to some other activities for the budget and… and things going on in the Governor's Office. But because of Leader Gabel, your commitment to make this process work, to have it be collaborative, to have mutual respect for shared priorities, the… the return of trust to this process is very important, and it's a reason I appreciate your commitment and the commitment of Chairman Morgan standing up and saying we're… we're going to continue to work on this issue that's been presented regarding scope of practice for pharmacy test and treat. And… and that's an acceptable answer. We'll continue to work on this together, and we can reflect on the rest of this Medicaid package that's very important. It's 10300113.docx 154  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 very good. Doing things to assist our hospitals, our behavioral health providers, our nursing homes, these are things that matter, and this is a collaboration that we can all be proud of. I certainly am, Leader Gabel, and urge an… an 'aye' vote and thank you for your leadership."

"Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Thank you. Leader Gabel, I just had a quick question about Article 100, which relates to the supportive living expansion. I wanted to make sure that I'm understanding this correctly. It… it appears that we are expanding the supportive living program to an additional several counties. Is that correct?"

"So, in our analysis, we have either no cost attributed to this or TBD, and I just wondered if you knew if there was a cost related to this."

"So, would it…"

"Fully agree, and I think that's a really good point, that it may redirect some folks to a… to a least restrictive setting that they can still get Medicaid dollars. So, I guess, 10300113.docx 155  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 maybe that's something to review going forward 'cause that also, of course, could lead to more people being in those supportive living facilities and have some sort of cost impact."

"Okay. Thank you so much. To the Bill. Really appreciate the work on…"

"…this Bill by all parties, especially staff, and urge an 'aye' vote. Thank you."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Thank you. And so, Representative, we talked about this before, during, and after committee. And so, it affects two counties that have come to you, Will and Kane County, 10300113.docx 157  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 about separate issues, but you want to apply it statewide. My question is, why does the county want to lease… Will County want to lease their older courthouse for a museum or do whatever? Why… why do you need to… explain to us what's going on here because I'm concerned why we want to change the law for an older county-owned building for a museum."

"Right. Well, I reached out to a county in the district I serve in, and they had an older courthouse that they moved out of to a newer facility, and they just made an… an agreement with the historical society for their old courthouse to become a museum. I… I don't know… I think they had every ounce of authority already in Counties Code to do that. Nobody has challenged that yet. I would assume that there's maybe other counties across the state that have done that also. So, I… I'm just concerned about changing state statute for a one-off situation here that can already be done. What makes this museum situation in Will County unique to do this?"

"Okay. And the other situation deals with Kane County, and they have a… a property, evidently, that they want to lease to somebody for athletic purposes?" 10300113.docx 158  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"Right. So, we discussed this situation in a different manner last year, dealing with farmland and what the county can or can't do with farm ground. We know that other codes, Municipality Code, the Airport Code, different things like that, can allow different things to happen. My concern is the County Code, when you look at the Constitution, really doesn't allow this kind of thing to happen, to lease out property, abandoned or otherwise, for a for-profit enterprise. And I would assume this athletic purpose, when we're leasing it to somebody, is for a for-profit enterprise. Is that correct?"

"Right. So, explain to me why we're leasing county property for an athletic purpose. Explain to us what that is 10300113.docx 159  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 because I think that falls outside of the Constitution, the… the article or the section that you just recited."

"Yep. So, Ladies and Gentlemen of the House, my concern here is that if the county gets to looking at this, renting or leasing property out for for-profit enterprises, an overzealous county board, or an overzealous county executive, or whatever the style of government you may or may not have in your county, may decide to go out and buy additional property regardless of what it is. We're already expanding the purposes here, so they'll just come back to the General Assembly and say, hey, we… expand the purpose for us to own a strip mall, whatever the case might be, we think this is important, we think it serves a public purpose. And it expands the size of government, putting dollars, taxpayer dollars, at risk when they do this. That's why I think it's really important this is not a role of county government to be in these kinds of situations. Your museum situation with… with Will County, I think the… the Constitution, the statute gives you the authority to do that. I don't think it gives you the authority to do it for the Kane County athletic purposes. You're wanting to change the law here for a kind of a one- off situation. I think this leads us and goes down a road that we don't need to go down. To that point. I've asked you about where's the prohibition to keep counties from going out 10300113.docx 160  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 and buying additional property to do the things here that they're trying to do with property that they already own."

"Yep."

"There's nothing said there that keeps them from acquiring additional property. There's nothing… I mean…"

"…the county can buy, and sell, and hold, and lease, the county can do that, but it has to be for the public purpose. And my concern is that we're going to get into buying property for a… for profit. And that's my concern here. That's not the role of county government. Ladies and Gentlemen, to the Bill. This is a bad idea."

"I don't think this is a good idea for counties to be getting in the business. This is not their role. I think this expands the size of government in our counties. I'm just going to urge a 'no' vote. Thank you." 10300113.docx 161  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Representative Hanson, being a Representative of Kane County, where almost my entire district lies within this county, I'm a little surprised that the House floor is the first time I'm hearing about this. What piece of property is Kane County looking to purchase to use for athletic purposes?"

"What property is Kane County looking to lease for athletic purposes?"

"Okay. Do you know which parcel?"

"Do you know what the intent is to do with that parcel of property?"

"So, we're just going to give them… so, what you're proposing is we give the county board…"

"…open-ended ability to compete with local property owners in… who are in business to lease or sell their property because Kane County just happens to own this piece."

"Doesn't the county already own property not too far from there where the Cougar stadium is? Didn't they purchase that a while ago?"

"Well, it really would have been great had someone approached me a little bit beforehand to let me know what they're thinking to do, and right in my backyard because that's exactly where my district butts up to. And this is the first I'm hearing about it on the House floor. To the Bill. You know, I… I hate… I would hate to quash a good idea in my own county, but I find it amazing that no one bothered coming to me and discussing it with me. And if the purpose of this is to put my county in competition with people who own property and are trying to do business within my county, I'm firmly opposed to that. That's not the taxpayer prerogative. That's not why we own property in Kane County. We're there… I'm to the Bill. We're there to use it for the public good. I'm going to urge a 'no' vote on this, in my backyard, because no one bothered explaining to me exactly what was happening with it. I would love to support it if it's a good idea, but seeing as how no one bothered telling me, I don't know whether it is or not. Vote 'no'."

"Thank you… thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Let's talk about the courthouse. That is owned now by the county. Is that correct?"

"Okay. No plans to sell the property or transfer it to a municipality or anything like that?"

"Okay. And this Bill specifically recognizes the prohibition of the county to do anything other than public use in that building. Is that correct?"

"Okay. So, they're not going to put a restaurant in it or anything like that. It's just going to be a museum and maybe some county offices that can overflow and stuff like that."

"But it's all public use."

"Okay. Thank you."

"Thank you, Madam Chair. To the Bill. This is…"

"…one of those, kind of my pet peeves. I hate to see… you know, I've seen forest preserves with dozens of homes they're renting. They're to keeping the buildings, using them for storage. Different government bodies, instead of getting rid 10300113.docx 164  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 and putting these properties back on the tax rolls, that they keep this stuff, you know, and… and try to run things like a business, which they're not. Anyway, I fought against this stuff for every year I've been in office. Please vote 'no'."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Representative, do we know if Will County, the board, slipped as a proponent?"

"The… the board was?"

"Their members were?"

"Okay. I saw that Kane County's board had slipped as a proponent, but I didn't see on the proponents whether the Will County Board had… had slipped. That's why I asked that question."

"Okay. Thank you."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Thank you. So, Representative, as you know, I also represent part of Kane County. First I'm hearing is when I'm reading the analysis on here. I'd like to propose a little bit of a solution because you're… you're stuck with this. It was a Senate Bill, it came over, it got assigned to you because you represent part of Kane County. I see we have a couple cosponsors from Kane County. This side of the aisle was kind of left out of that discussion. It directly impacts our constituents. So, here… here's what I would like to propose to you, whether you'd be interested in doing it or not, is… is if we could pull this from the record and have you urge madam chairwoman at Kane County to reach out to all the Representatives of Kane County and explain exactly what… what we're doing 'cause we have at least two more Session days that we're going to be here conducting business. And then we can reconsider it once that's there. I think it's the right thing to do because there's residents of Kane County and Will County whose Representatives have no idea what the intent is and what the scope is. I think it's bad form that folks that represent part of those counties have no knowledge or understanding of what happened because they didn't get the opportunity either speaking with a fellow Legislator or hearing from madam chairwoman. I think that's bad form, and I just would like to urge you to pull it from the record, give her a chance to reach out to the other people that are over here, and see if we can pick up again on the next business day."

"And I appreciate local control, believe me. There's a lot of people over here that like local control and have seen votes against local control happen over the last couple weeks. So, if we're going to put that out there, one of the difficulties with local control, and whether we're talking park districts, counties, cities, is… is we put parameters around that local control for a reason. And that reason is usually to make sure that we don't have too much authority assumed by those units of government. And I think that's one of the slippery slopes that we're looking at here, especially with the argument that was made by some of my peers earlier about property acquisition and competing with… with individuals in the private sector."

"Again, I'm just…"

"…appealing to our better angels to see if somebody else who created this mess before you can come in and fix it up so that we can make you a hero."

"I'm not suggesting that it does sneak through. What I am suggesting is that we are on the verge of the State of Illinois granting an expansion of powers to the county governments, and we don't have any idea about what that scope actually looks like. And that scope, as presented in a general form, makes people a little nervous because it could easily put… like, as… as we're looking at this, let's… let's be a little crazy. Kane County Forest Preserve, I believe you sat on the board for a little bit, right? Don't they have 24- thousand-some-odd acres of farmland right now?"

"Sounds about right?"

"Well, they could go out and lease all of that to other people and compete with other farmers. They could do it at a subpar level. They could wind up getting farmers in there that are farming their… farming their fields."

"They could put up strip malls. All I'm saying is…"

"Representative, I… I appreciate that. I'm going to leave the decision to you. I think it's bad form what we've seen so far, and I'm… I'm just trying to make that right for you. So, thank you."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Would you please excuse Randy Frese for the remainder of the day?" 10300113.docx 170  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Thank you. Representative, you've outlined that this is the TIF extension omnibus for the Session. For… in our analysis, they're outlined for our Members to review. Looks like about half… or, I'm sorry, a dozen or so communities or areas that are covered by this Bill, and appreciate you bringing this forward. I believe we've already celebrated your last Bill. Do we need to celebrate again after this?"

"Oh, okay. Thank you.

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. I do actually have two pieces of business for us."

"To the Bill."

"And this has no bearing on the Sponsor whatsoever. We see these every Session. We have for far too long ignored the need for TIF reform in this state. We have before us today consideration of taking in multiple cities across this state and extending TIFs from 23 years to 35 years and 35 years to 47 years. Thirty-five years ago was 1989. January 20, 1989 George Herbert Walker Bush was sworn into office. The 47-year extensions take us back to 1977, 47 years ago. January 20, 1977 was Jimmy Carter. He was inaugurated January 20, 1977. So, if we think about the decisions we were making in 1977 or 1989, those decisions are such a long time ago, and we are still saddling our taxpayers with the consequences of sometimes really bad decisions, and we're hobbling our schools by not allowing the funding that is bottled up within 10300113.docx 172  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 so many of these TIFs to help keep our property taxes down. And if you're like me, property taxes are one of the top issues that I hear from my constituents about. So, I understand the reasons why, and every single one of them I'm sure is a great argument. We need TIF reform. I have offered up two Bills in this General Assembly. House Bill 3312, which removes the ability to extend to 47 years for a TIF, and House Bill 4995, which puts the decision of whether a municipality or area engages in a TIF in the hands of the voters in the way of a referendum. We have far too long kicked the can on the abuses that we have seen in TIFs. I encourage us to stand up, make a change that will improve the lives of the property taxpayer in the State of Illinois. Thank you."

"Thank you. To the Bill."

"Thank you. I don't disagree with the previous speaker. However, unfortunately, here in Illinois, we do have poor policy that makes us… puts us in a position that we have to have TIFs because smaller communities, especially, don't have the tools in their toolboxes for economic development. So, as a previous mayor, and many of you have been in municipal government, understand this completely. And I… although I agree that there is need of TIF reform, I think more so than that we need overall structural reform so that we could have better policy and not have to have these kind of things. And also, I would just like to say thank you to Representative Yednock for your service as well. I know that Leader Hammond said it before, and it is… you are really going to be a… a 10300113.docx 173  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 loss to the House and really appreciate your commonsense approach. Thank you."

"To the Bill, Madam Chair."

"You know, I… I don't have a problem with some of the TIF districts that I've seen over the years. However, just like other things, you know, they have to come to an end. These things would… the end of a district would mean… TIF district would mean thousands of dollars going back into the levies of villages, school districts, and everything else and would directly lower people's property taxes. You've heard me say it a million times, and let's stop extending these TIF districts. And while we're at it, let's put an end to the back-to-back referendums for the school districts and other areas of government and give taxpayers a break that they deserve. Thank you."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Thank you. Representative, this is… the Amendment in the Senate was a gut and replace from the Bill we saw previously. Is that accurate?"

"So, just for our Members, the vote you saw previously may not necessarily indicate the vote you would be leaning towards on this concurrence. So, these involve judicial subcircuits 16, 17, 18, 19, and 20. Where are those located?"

"In Cook County. And overall, we're dealing with vacancies in associate judgeships that are being converted to resident judgeships. Is that accurate?"

"And is some of what you've stated already in law or rule and we're just dealing with the timing or are there substantive changes?"

"Go ahead, I'm sorry."

"And these provisions solely deal with the subcircuits in Cook County that are outlined in the Bill."

"All right. Thank you."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Thank you. Leader, you had mentioned this is subject to appropriation. Do we have an estimated cost if there was an appropriation?"

"Do we know what the overall cost would be for the entire program?" 10300113.docx 179  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024

"And these are scholarships for nurses to… who will work within the Department of Corrections. Is that accurate?"

"I… I know there was a question raised about the current contractor with the Department of Corrections, Wexford, I believe is the name of the company. Is it anticipated that these nurses will be working within that company, or be they working… will they be working for the department?"

"In the underlying Bill before the Amendment, there was language that prohibited discrimination on the basis of race, sex, religion, the standard provisions for anti- discrimination, and I noticed that was not included in the Amendment. Was there a reason why the discrimination language was removed?"

"Well… and federal law will dictate a lot of the anti- discrimination, as well as state law, I would… would say. And 10300113.docx 180  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 so, that may be why it's not included. Just struck me as unusual that that would be in there and then removed. But what you're saying is the template is following what ISAC's template is for other scholarship programs?"

"Thank you."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. This past first part of May, we celebrated bacon, bacon, bacon, as we all enjoyed some BLTs in the back, provided to us by the Illinois Pork Producers. I'm going to make this real short. Tomorrow, when you're enjoying your piece of bacon with your breakfast, remember that you are eating part of that 18 pounds the average American eats per day, and the Illinois hog farmers produce over 6 billion slices of bacon annually, and that the 2023 global bacon market 68.5 billion in 2022. So, pork industry supports 57 thousand jobs and has an income to… or 10300113.docx 182  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 an economy effect of $13.8 billion to our economy. So, belly up to the breakfast bar tomorrow and eat bacon. Thank you."

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. A point of personal privilege."

"Representative Swanson, can you make sure that next year Bacon Day doesn't fall on police memorial?"

"Point of personal privilege."

"I also want to point out that this Resolution is the final piece of legislation of my former seatmate and very good friend, now-Senator Tom Bennett. So, I want to recognize Tom for his service here, service in the Senate, his service to the State of Illinois, and his service to the pork producers of Illinois. Thank you."

"Point of personal privilege."

"Illinois Politics: It's Complicated by Travis Weaver and Mark Revis. 'Eggs, milk, bread, more expensive than they've ever been. Rent, gasoline, toothpaste too, can't you see what 10300113.docx 183  STATE OF ILLINOIS 103rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 113th Legislative Day 5/25/2024 government can do? People and businesses head south to places they can grow. Leaving us all behind just shivering in the snow. As the budget grows, paying our taxes feels like an annual violation. The clear solution? Have DCEO collect demographic information. Along with higher costs, communities deal with more crime. Just imagine what Illinois could be with Caleb Williams in his prime. Good ideas are sidelined, like tax relief for families and businesses too. But what takes priority, a ban on exotic cats, even the kangaroo? An honor… it's an honor to serve in this chamber. We all have something we can bring. Apparently, we even have somebody who's an expert at declaring "ding, ding, ding, ding." So let's unify on a Bill, heck let's unify on seven. Let's all team up and pass a first Bill for Kevin. And to Lance, Kelly, Randy, Cyril, Jen, Mary, and Dan, you'll be greatly missed. We hope you remember us well with a cold drink in your hand. So, with that, I come to a close on this time filler. But let's keep this between us. No need to share with Rich Miller.'"

"Thank you, Madam Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"Excellent. I want to thank you again, Representative, for working on this. I know we changed two provisions. One of them kind of help satisfy the workplace issue that we had going on, and one satisfied the landlord concerns with… with some of the discriminatory practices. I just want to thank you for working so diligently on this and getting a good product across the line. I think we'll have people on both sides of this issue, but I think it was the right thing to do. So, thank you." Williams, A.: "Thank you."

"Madam Speaker, if we could please excuse Representatives Wilhour and Miller for the remainder of today."