April 19, 1994 "The House will come to order. The House will come to order. The Chaplain for today is Reverend Edward McGhee of the Alpha Omega Church in Champaign, Illinois. Reverend McGhee is the guest of Representative Tim Johnson. The guests in the balcony may wish to rise and join us for the invocation."
"Let us Pray. Oh, Lord, we praise You for our country, it's beauty and riches that it has to give to us. We thank You for Your people, the gift of the languages we speak. The variety of races we have, the cultural heritage...we cherish at length the possibilities that are within our counties. Lord, we thank You for Your kindness. Oh God, King of Kings, Lord of Lords, we pray today for the statesman's leaders, rulers and this House of Representatives. May they be quiet in spirit, clear in judgment, able to understand the issues that face them. May they think often of the common people on whose behalf they must speak and act. May they remember that in keeping Your laws is man only good in happiness. Grant them patience, grant them courage, grant them foresight and great faith. In their anxiety, be their security. In their opportunity, be their inspiration. By their plans and action, may Your kingdom come, Your will be done. In Jesus name, Amen."
"We'll be led in the Pledge of Allegiance by Representative Pankau."
Pankau et al: "I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
"Roll Call for Attendance. Kubik." Representative 1 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day
April 19, 1994 "Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Let the record reflect that all the Republican Members are present today."
"Thank you. Ms. Currie."
"Thank you, Speaker. Let the record reflect that Representative Giglio is excused, and Representative Saltsman is excused because of the death of his mother."
"Take the record. One hundred and sixteen Members answering the roll call, a quorum is present. Committee Reports."
"Representative Phelps, vice-Chairman from the Committee on Constitutional Officers, to which the following Bills were referred, action taken on April 14, 1994, reported the same back with the following recommendations: 'do pass Short Debate' House Bills 2732, 4091, 4092, 4093. Representative Homer, Chairman from the Committee on Judiciary II, to which the following Bills were referred, action taken on April 14, 1994, reported the same back with the following recommendations: 'do pass' House Bills 2491, 2568, 2684, 2718, 2815, 2832, 2855, 3252, 3317, 3385, 3386, 3416, 3537, 3686, 4018, 4019, 4063, 2819, 3735; 'do pass as amended' House Bills 2818, 3276, 3821; 'do pass Short Debate' House Bills 2557, 2636, 2644, 2804, 2807, 2976, 3117, 3165, 3170, 3173, 3174, 3527, 3683, 3833, 3851, 3914, 3940, 3988, 3927, 4010, 4025, 4094; 'do pass as amended Short Debate' House Bills 2808 and 2816. Corrected Committee Report, Counties and Townships, reported House Bill 3809 should have been reported out. House Bill 3809 was reported out 'do pass Short Debate'."
"Messages from the Senate.
"A Message from the Senate by Mr. Harry, Secretary. 'Mr. Speaker, I am directed to inform the House of Representatives that the Senate has concurred with the 2 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day House and the adoption of the following by Mr. Harry; Secretary. inform the House April 19, 1994 Joint Resolution. House Joint Resolution 137, concurred in the Senate, April 15, 1994. Jim Harry; Secretary'. A Message from the Senate 'Mr. Speaker, I am directed to of Representatives that the Senate has passed the Bills of the following titles and the passage of which, I am instructed to ask the concurrence of the House of Representatives to wit: Senate Bill 1670, Senate Bill 1672, Senate Bill 1692, Senate Bill 1693, Senate Bill 1700, Senate Bill 1704, Senate Bill 1707, Senate Bill 1708, Senate Bill 1711, Senate Bill 1712, Senate Bill 1714, Senate Bill 1718, Senate Bill 1719, Senate Bill 1720 and Senate Bill 1722. Passed the Senate April 14, 1994. Jim Harry; Secretary of the Senate'. A Message from the Senate by Mr. Harry, Secretary. 'Mr. Speaker, I am directed to inform the House of Representatives that the Senate has passed the Bills of the following titles and the passage of which I'm instructed to ask the concurrence of the House of Representatives to wit: Senate Bill 454. Senate Bill 1149. Senate Bill 1153. Senate Bill 1165. Senate Bill 1206, Senate Bill 1279, Senate Bill 1302, Senate Bill 1319, Senate Bill 1328, Senate Bill 1365, Senate Bill 1726, Senate Bill 1729, Senate Bill 1803, Senate Bill 1182, Senate Bill 1251, Senate Bill 1297, Senate Bill 1384, Senate Bill 1427, Senate Bill 1448, Senate Bill 1468, Senate Bill 1681, Senate Bill 1717 and Senate Bill 1125. Jim Harry; Secretary'."
"Representative Novak."
"Yes, Mr. Speaker. I'd like to leave the waive the posting requirements for two Bills that have been cleared with the Republican side of the aisle. House Bill 4211, sponsored by Representative Giles. House Bill 3623, 3 117th Legislative Day STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE April 19, 1994 sponsored by Representative Tom Ryder, so these Bills can be heard in committee tomorrow."
"Representative Novak, we're going to take that Motion out of the record for a moment. We're going to take that out of the record; we'll get back to you. Representative Biggins."
"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to move to suspend the posting requirements relative to House Bill 3881 assigned to the Revenue Committee. This measure has been approved, request has been approved by the Chairman of the Committee. Representative Levin; and Representative Currie has also indicated she would agree to this."
"Well, we're trying to get a list of all the Bills that need to have the posting requirements waived. So, let us get that list before we make any more Motions on suspension of the posting requirements. Mr. Hicks."
"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As Chairman of the House Insurance Committee, I would move that to suspend the posting requirements."
"Mr. Hicks, we're going to hold those for awhile until we can get a list of all the Bills that need that, and we're working on that list. Mr. Hicks."
"Yes, Mr. Speaker would you like my numbers, to see if they couldn't be added to the list?"
"Yes."
"House Bill 4189, and House Bill 4182."
"For general information, when the Bills came out of rules last week they were posted for this week, but it was too late to post for Tuesdays. We posted the Bills for Wednesday and Thursday. So, every Bill that came out of rules last week that was scheduled to be heard on Tuesday cannot be heard unless we waive the posting requirements, 4 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994 and we're trying to get an agreement from both sides of the aisle to do that. Mr. Woolard."
"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Maybe I need you to repeat just what you just now said. Did you say that it was too late to suspend the posting notice?"
"No, it was too late to post them last week."
"Okay, I'm sorry."
"So, in order to get them heard we have to suspend the posting requirements. We're trying to get the Minority Party to agree to this."
"I'd like to waive the posting requirements for House Bill 2655, for the Ag and Conservation Committee this evening."
"We're trying to put that list together, Mr. Woolard."
"Okay, add that to the list please."
"All right. Constitutional Amendments, Third Reading. HJRCA #35. Mr. Clerk, read the Resolution."
"House Joint Resolution #35, offered by Speaker Madigan. HOUSE JOINT RESOLUTION CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT RESOLVED, BY THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES OF THE EIGHTY-EIGHTH GENERAL ASSEMBLY OF THE STATE OF ILLINOIS, THE SENATE CONCURRING HEREIN, That there shall be submitted to the electors of the State for adoption or rejection at the general election next occurring at least 6 months after the adoption of this resolution a proposition to amend Section 10 of Article IV of the Illinois Constitution as follows: ARTICLE IV THE LEGISLATURE SECTION 10. EFFECTIVE DATE OF LAWS The General Assembly shall provide by law for a uniform effective date for laws passed prior to June July 1 of a calendar year. The General Assembly may provide for a different effective date in any law passed prior to June 5 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994 July 1. A bill passed after May 31 June-30 shall not become effective prior to June July 1 of the next calendar year unless the General Assembly by the vote of three-fifths of the members elected to each house provides for an earlier effective date. Third Reading of this House Joint Resolution Constitutional Amendment."
"Speaker Madigan."
"Mr. Speaker, Ladies and Gentlemen. I rise in support of this Constitutional Amendment. This Constitutional Amendment is relatively simple, it simply changes the effective date of laws from June 30, July 1 to May 30, June 1, which would bring us into compliance with what our goal has been over the last couple of years, which is to end the Session at the end of May. And, so I would move for the passage of this Resolution."
"Is there any discussion? Is there any discussion? Who wants to speak? Mr. Stephens."
"For the record, Mr. Speaker. Will the Gentleman yield? Is this..."
"Yes."
"Is this the susan Bill as originally introduced by Senator Watson's wife, as a concept several years ago."
"I don't think I know the lady. I think I've met the husband, but I don't think I've met the lady."
"She had the concept as one she pushed several years ago Sir, she's quite an outstanding lady, and is very family-oriented, and I would stand in support of your, the House Joint Resolution."
"The question is, 'Shall the House adopt House Joint Resolution Constitutional Amendment #35?' All in favor vote 'aye'; opposed vote 'no'. This requires a three-fifths vote. Have all voted? Have all voted who 6 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day wish? April 19, 1994 is The Clerk will take the record. On this Motion, there are 115 'ayes', 0 'nays'. This Resolution, having received a three- fifths Constitutional Majority, adopted. House Bill, Second Reading. Special order, Agriculture. House Bill 2564, Representative Granberg. Do you want this Bill read? Read the Bill, Mr. Clerk."
"House Bill 2564, a Bill for an Act amending the Insect Pest and Plant Disease Act. Second Reading of the Bill. No Committee Amendments. No Floor Amendments."
Brunsvold. "Third Reading. House Bill 2629, Representative Brunsvold. Out of the record. House Bill 2795, Representative Woolard. Mr. Clerk." Mr. Woolard. Read the Bill,
"House Bill 2795, a Bill for an Act amending the Wildlife Code. Second Reading of the Bill. No Committee Amendments. No Floor Amendments. A fiscal note has been requested on the Bill."
"Representative Woolard, there's a fiscal note requested on this technical Bill. What is your pleasure, Sir?"
"I would like to ask Representative Black if he would give due consideration to withdraw that request?"
"Mr. Black."
"Yes, thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. I hold the Sponsor in very high regard, but I really at this point can't withdraw the fiscal note until I know what the Bill, what his intention is. His intention may be to spend all kinds of money, and not in my district. If he could just enlighten Us as to what his intentions are with the Bill, perhaps we could accommodate his request."
"Mr. Woolard. Mr. Woolard."
"Mr. Speaker, I believe that the express intent of this 7 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE April 19, 1994 117th Legislative Day legislation is very forthright and up-front and I believe it's inapplicable at this time."
"All right, the Gentleman moves that the fiscal note is not applicable. All those in favor of the Gentleman's Motion. Mr. Black, on the Motion."
"Well, thank you very much, Mr. Speaker, and in all due respect to the Sponsor, I must object to his Motion and would ask and quote the appropriate rule and am joined by four others that we have a Roll Call Vote on the Gentleman's Motion. I think the Rule is 55 (c), and I'm joined by four others. You know, I, this has a dangerous precedent, and I have no, I have no doubt that the Sponsor has only the best of intentions for this Bill. I know his work in the legislative sportsman's caucus has been outstanding, and I usually join with him in anything of that nature. But, to the issue before us. If you just simply move that a fiscal note does not apply, before you even know what the Bill does or what it will be used for, that's a roll call that may come back to haunt you. I f there is a specific purpose for the Bill, then a fiscal note can be filed, and we can make a rational decision on the matter before us, and since I have no idea of what this Bill does, and it amends the Wildlife Code, and the last time we got into this we raised fees on senior citizens, an idea that a lot of people didn't like. So, I'm here to tell you that I object to the Gentleman's Motion, and I ask for a roll call on his Motion that a fiscal note does not apply. All you have to do is look at a balance sheet and know that a fiscal note applies to practically every Bill that we debate in this chamber, and I don't think it's an unreasonable request to ask for a fiscal note, when we have no idea what the Bill will be used for." 8 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE April 19, 1994 117th Legislative Day
"Mr. Black, the Chair is very close to holding that, this fiscal note is dilatory. This is a vehicle Bill. You have filed a fiscal note on every single Bill on Second Reading. It's apparent that this Bill, that the fiscal not does note apply to this Bill, and the Chair is close to so ruling. Mr. Granberg."
"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I was going to make the same points you did to my, we do respect the Gentleman from Danville. If you look at the Bill, it does not say a fiscal note may apply. It is a shell Bill; the fiscal not clearly, act clearly does note apply. Nowhere on the Bill itself does it say the Fiscal Note Act may apply, it does not apply, so the Motion is dilatory. With all due respect there is nothing in the Bill. The Fiscal Note Act applies to Bills on Second Reading where they may apply. There's nothing in the Bill, and you can't apply a fiscal note to something that may happen in the future. So, I know the Gentleman would never, never intentionally make a dilatory Motion; never, he would not do that. So, I'm just trying to bring his attention to the fact that this might be considered dilatory, it is dilatory so he would withdraw his request."
"Representative Daniels."
"Mr. Speaker, Ladies and Gentlemen of the House, a Representative Black is merely saying that when you have Bill that is dilatory, because nobody knows what the Bill says; House Bill 2795, by Mr. Granberg's own statement is a Vehicle Bill. Now, for common terminology, what that means is the Bill says nothing. That it's intended to be for some other purpose other than which it was introduced, and some point in the future, we on the Republican side, along with the rest of the people of the State of Illinois may be 9 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994 advised of what sinister purpose House Bill 2795 may serve. So, I think that Representative Blacks Motion and filing of the fiscal note is completely applicable, and the reason for that is, if as using Representative Granberg's language, it's dilatory, it's filed to a dilatory Bill, to keep that on Second Reading until such point that this Legislator and his operatives on the other side of the aisle want to let the people of Illinois know what dirty, dastardly deeds they have in mind for the rest of the people of Illinois, and I think it's very important that we do everything we can to keep this Bill on Second Reading. Because we have learned before, that what lurks in the past by the Democrats, our tax increases, income tax increases that we have no idea where they come from; Effingham or wherever they may be, following out. This could end up as a riverboat gambling Bill, strictly located in the 13th ward in Chicago. This could end up to be some kind of an education procedure that we may file and find that the people of Illinois will be destroyed of their educational benefits, and frankly as I said to Representative Noland earlier, it's amazing to me. If I was a person that was interested in agriculture, I would be scared to death of leaving my future, my course in the hands of this Legislator who may come back and say we're going to take away all agricultural products from Illinois. Those are the things that can happen to this Legislator. I can't believe that anybody is not overly concerned about the possibilities; what could occur on this Wildlife Code. As a matter of fact, Mr. Speaker, I love animals, and I will not have any single part in legislation that takes away my right to own animals, and I'm afraid that what we may have here is a Bill that will take away my rights to own 10 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994 animals, and I just think it's proposterous, and I for one will argue until this is all over, so that we can make sure that we continue our right to own animals. Look at the name of this Bill; Wildlife Code. Who knows what could happen with it. Let us in on your secret, Mr. Sponsor. Tell us what you're going to do to Illinois with this Bill? Don't move this Bill until we know."
"All right, the Chair is going to look at the title of the Bill, and the title of the Bill says 'Wildlife Code, Technical'. The purpose of the Fiscal Act, and the purpose of filing fiscal notes was to give the Members of this Body some idea as to how much this Bill would cost in its current form when it goes to Third Reading. Since it's apparent that this Bill costs nothing in its current form, because it does nothing, it's a vehicle Bill. The Chair will rule that the fiscal note request is not dilatory. Mr. Granberg's point is well-taken. Third Reading. Mr. Woolard."
"Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Ladies and Gentlemen of the House."
"Excuse me, Mr. Stephens. Mr. Stephens."
"Mr. Speaker, was not a roll call vote requested on that last Motion? The answer is 'yes'."
"There was no Motion. The Chair ruled on Mr. Granberg's point of order, and the Motion on his point of order was that it was dilatory."
"Was there not a Motion that the fiscal note..."
"The Chair so ruled, and you can move to overrule the Chair, Mr. Stephens. Mr. Woolard. Mr. Stephens."
"A Motion was made that the fiscal note was inapplicable."
"Mr. Granberg called a point of order and the 11 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994 Chair agreed with his point, and your position at this point is to move to override the Chairs' ruling."
"Mr. Speaker, I would like a response to my first question, if you don't mind."
"I answered that. Now, do you wish to override the Chair."
"The answer was what, Sir? The answer was yes?"
"I'm not going to repeat the answer a third time, Mr. Stephens."
"Well, Mr. Speaker, you're not speaking very clearly."
"Mr. Woolard."
"Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Ladies and Gentlemen of the House. I think that each and every Representative in this Body has responsibilities to deal with legislation as they see fit for the constituency that they represent. But, I also believe that we have responsibilities to our peers, and I think that we have responsibilities to treat with dignity those people that we serve with, and I take exception to the statements that were made by the speaker from the previous side of the aisle a few minutes ago. And I believe that I have every right and responsibility to serve those people that selected me to represent them, and I will do so with the kind of integrity that I believe that will ensure that I gain and continue to have, the respect of those people that I serve with. I want that to continue, I do not like in any way the derogatory statements that were made by a certain individual who spoke that I'm looking at right now; he's waving at me. I think that we have a great opportunity to make great news and laws for this great state, but I don't believe that we should be stepping on each others toes at any time, and especially after we have been stomping the grapes, and have 12 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day purple feet." April 19, 1994
"All right, may we move ahead now? The next Bill is House Bill 3531. Representative Woolard. Mr. Woolard. Read the Bill, Mr. Clerk."
"House Bill 3531, a Bill for an Act amending the Illinois Farm Development Act. Second Reading of the Bill. No Committee Amendments. No Floor Amendments."
"Third Reading. House Bill 3624, Representative Wirsing. Do you wish the Bill called? Read the Bill, Mr. Clerk."
"House Bill 3624, a Bill for an Act amending the Humane Care of Animals Act. Second Reading of the Bill. No Committee Amendments. No Floor Amendments."
"Third Reading. Representative Lawfer, 3693. Mr. Black, for what reason do you rise? Mr. Lawfer, do wish this Bill called? Mr. Lawfer, do you wish this Bill called? No, out of the record. Mr. Black. Someone turn off Mr. Parke's light."
"Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. I have an inquiry of the Chair."
"Yes."
"On the previous ruling of the Chair in regards to the dilatory ruling on a fiscal note. I was under the impression that we had invoked Rule 81 and asked for a ruling to ask the Members if we could be joined by sufficient number of people to overrule the Chair? I thought we'd asked for that, and you went on, so I don't what eventually happened. Did you so rule the fiscal note is dilatory?"
"For the third time. For a third time, all right. You asked for a roll call on Representative Woolard's Motion." 13 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994
"On the Motion, yes."
"Which I would have granted. Mr. Granberg made a point of order, the Chair agreed with the point of order. There was never a roll call in the Motion. That was never any request on a roll call on anything. That point of order was made. The point of order agreed with Representative Granberg, the Chair so ruled. At that point you have a choice. If you don't like the ruling you can move to override the Chair."
"Well, I thought that was what we did."
"I offered Representative Stephens that twice, but he refused to make the Motion, so I moved ahead."
"Okay, all right. I thought he did, I'm sorry."
"Representative Schoenberg. House Bill 3755. Out of the record. Mr. Black, 3913. Mr. Black. Read the Bill."
"House Bill 3913, a Bill for an Act amending the Wildlife Code. Second Reading of the Bill. No Committee Amendments."
"Any Floor Amendments? Mr. Black, there's an Amendment filed that's not been printed. Out of the record? Out of the record. Banking, Second Reading. House Bill 2962, Representative Kotlarz. Is the Gentleman here? Read the Bill."
"House Bill 2962, a Bill for an Act concerning the Dissemination of Credit Information. Second Reading of the Bill. No Committee Amendments. Floor Amendment #1, offered by Representative Kotlarz."
"Mr. Kotlarz, Amendment #1, it's your Amendment. Mr. Kotlarz. Turn on Mr. Kotlarz, please. Amendment #1."
"I'd like to pass Amendment #1."
"The Gentleman moves for the adoption of 14 117th Legislative Day STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE Amendment #1. Representative Kubik."
"Could he tell us what it does."
"Mr. Kotlarz." April 19, 1994
"Use the word commissioner."
"I beg your pardon."
"I don't think Mr. Kubik heard you."
"I, I think he did."
"Mr. Kubik. No, he didn't."
"No, really. What does the Amendment do? I'm truly curious what the Amendment does."
"Mr. Speaker, I'll send him a copy of the Amendment."
"Mr. Black, on a 'do pass' Motion. I'm sorry, Mr. Kubik, you still have the floor, Sir. Mr. Kubik."
"I know that he talked about sending over an Amendment. All I'm asking him to do is explain what the Amendment does. I don't think that's an unreasonable request."
"Mr. Kotlarz."
"Just a minute, we're asking for a copy of the Amendment."
"Do you want to take it out of the record?."
"Representative Kubik. As I suggested before, it simply defines the word 'commissioner'."
"Okay."
"Mr. Black."
"I, it defines the word 'commission'? What did he say, I can't hear in here?"
"Mr. Kotlarz."
"Mr..."
"The same question again. Mr. Kotlarz, Mr. Black is asking the same question again."
"Mr. Black, it simply defines the term 'commissioner' and it adds a defining term specifying a credit reporting 15 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE April 19, 1994 117th Legislative Day agency."
"Mr. Black."
"Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. If the Sponsor will yield, I think we can quickly straighten this out. 'Commissioner' in his Amendment means the 'Commissioner' of Saving and Residential Finance, is that correct?
"Correct."
"All right, thank you."
"The question is, 'Shall Amendment #1 be adopted?' All those in favor say 'aye'; opposed, 'no'. The 'ayes' have it, and the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?"
"No further Amendments, but a fiscal note has been requested on the Bill."
"Mr. Kotlarz, a fiscal note has been requested. The Bill stays on...a fiscal note has been requested. Stays on Second Reading. A fiscal note has been requested, so the Bill stays on Second Reading, until you file that fiscal note. Mr. Kotlarz."
"All right, thank you."
"Mr. Kotlarz, 3082 is the next Bill, do you wish the next Bill called? (House Bill) 3082. Read the Bill, Mr. Clerk."
"House Bill 3082, a Bill for an Act concerning the reproduction of business records. Second Reading of the Bill. No Committee Amendments. No Floor Amendments, but a fiscal note has been requested on the Bill."
"The Bill stays on Second Reading. It's got a request for a fiscal note on the Bill. Mr. Granberg. Representative Granberg."
"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Once again, in the case with House Bill 3082, the Motion, the request for a fiscal note 16 117th Legislative Day STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE April 19, 1994 is dilatory. Once again, there is no indication that this Bill has any fiscal impact at all, because on the Bill itself there's no indication that it, it could even possibly have any effect. So the Motion, it is dilatory, and I would so move."
"Mr. Wennlund."
"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Could we have some order in here? I couldn't hear a thing he said?"
"He asked the Chair to take a look at the Bill to see if this fiscal note is also dilatory. Mr. Wennlund."
"Well, Mr. Speaker. Unless we can have some order in this chamber, so we can figure out what's going on with this entire process, and I want to make it clear that it's not the individual Sponsor, and nothing was meant derogatory in any fashion of the Sponsor, of whom I have the highest regard for, and consider a friend, and I'm sure everybody else does on this aisle. What it's about here is the process. An abuse of the process that we witnessed a week ago. On Wednesday when the debate took place on the gun ban, abuse of the process is what we're talking about here. We're not talking about any individual Sponsors or what their intentions are. We're talking about the process, and this process stinks."
"Mr. Black has withdrawn his fiscal note request on House Bill 3082. The Bill has been read a second time. Third Reading. Thank you, Mr. Black. On page 31 of the Calendar, appears HJRCA #31. Mr. Clerk, read the Joint Resolution."
"HOUSE JOINT RESOLUTION CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT #31, offered by Speaker Madigan. RESOLVED, BY THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES OF THE EIGHTY-EIGHTH GENERAL ASSEMBLY OF THE STATE OF ILLINOIS, THE SENATE CONCURRING HEREIN, That 17 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994 there shall be submitted to the electors of the State for adoption or rejection at the general election next occurring at least 6 months after the adoption of this resolution a proposition to amend Section 11 of Article VI of the Illinois Constitution as follows: ARTICLE VI THE JUDICIARY SECTION 11. ELIGIBILITY FOR OFFICE NO person shall be eligible to be a Judge or Associate Judge unless that person he is a United States citizen, a licensed attorney-at-law of this State for at least 10 years before his or her term begins, and a resident of the unit which selects him or her. No change in the boundaries of a unit shall affect the tenure in office of a Judge or Associate Judge incumbent at the time of such change. SCHEDULE This Constitutional Amendment takes effect upon approval by the electors of this State. This Constitutional Amendment Resolution has been read a third time in full as amended."
"Speaker Madigan."
"Mr. Speaker, and Ladies and Gentlemen. This Constitutional Amendment would add an additional requirement for a person to serve as a judge in the State of Illinois. Today, the Constitution provides that for a person to serve as a judge, they must be a United States citizen, they must be a licensed attorney, and they must be a resident of the district. This would provide that for a person to be qualified to serve as a judge in the State of Illinois they must have served as a licensed attorney for ten years. The purpose of this is to respond to certain situations which have developed in the last few years, where people are being elected to judgeships where they have two or three years experience as a licensed attorney. Seems to me that this is something that ought to have been included in the original document prepared by the 18 117th Legislative Day STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE April 19, 1994 Constitutional Convention; it wasn't, we can do it with this Amendment, and with the ratification of the voters at the next general election. I would recommend an 'aye' vote."
"And on the 'do adopt' Motion, Representative Kubik."
"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Could we have some order, this is a rather important issue. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This is a very important issue that will, if it passes, go to the voters, and I think it's one that each and every Member ought to think carefully about. First of all, I would like to commend the Sponsor of the Resolution. I know what Representative, Speaker Madigan is attempting to, to deal with the problem which we've read about in the press over the last couple of years, and I know there is a problem. I'm not sure this is the way to solve that problem. What we're saying here, Ladies and Gentlemen is we're actually putting some qualifications as to who can run for public office for a judicial office. I think that's a dangerous precedent. I could agree that you must live in the district; I could agree that you have to have a legal license, which the Speaker pointed out was the subject of debate in the 1970 Constitution, and it was decided that at that time there ought to, if you are a judge, you ought to have a legal license. I think we can all agree with that. This goes a lot farther than those other two provisions. This provision says that you have to be an attorney for a specific amount of time, that is ten years. It doesn't say what type of attorney you have been; whether you've been a states attorney, a public defender, or any other type of attorney, and I think that this is, this is a kind of a dangerous encroachment upon the qualifications of public 19 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994 office. We, as State Representatives, aren't required to have a certain amount of experience to run for the Legislature and get elected and make laws. That is a decision that is made by the voters, not by a Constitutional Amendment, it's made by voters. They look at the records of each one of us, and decide whether we have the requisite experience to serve in this chamber. I don't think there's anything, I don't think it ought to be any different than those who are elected to a judicial office. That is, that is part of the debate that takes place in an election campaign on the issue of whether you ought to be a judge or not, and I would submit to you that I think that ten years is a rather arbitrary number. For example, why, who should have more experience, a person who has closed real estate deals for ten years, and now is considered to have the requisite amount of experience to be a judge, or a states attorney, or a public defender whose in front of a judge every single day of their career, and they may only serve four or five years? I think that clearly those people have more experience that dealing with issues of law than a real estate attorney. So, the point is that this is an arbitrary figure, it should not be adopted, and I think this starts us down the road to a very, very dangerous set of precedents. Will the next, will the next Amendment be that we ought to have a certain amount of experience to be a State Representative or a mayor, or any other kind of elective office. I think this is where we're headed. Let me just leave you with one final thought, and that is that when we, we have decided in this state to allow judges to be elected. That's a decision that has been made by the Constitutional Convention. It's a decision that's been reinforced by the 20 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994 Legislature. If we are willing and if it is the public policy of this state to elect judges, then I think we ought to allow the people who have the power to elect judges, the right to make decisions on whether somebody is qualified or not to serve in that office, and that's what's the issue right here, is whether or not voters should have the opportunity to decide who has the requisite amount of experience rather than a Constitutional Amendment, which decides that before we even get to the ballot box. This is, although a very well intended proposal, and again I commend the Speaker for trying to attack this problem, this is the wrong way to go. This starts us down the wrong road. I urge a 'no' vote on this issue."
"Representative Lang."
"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I rise in support of this proposal. This is not about doing anything except making sure the judiciary has experienced lawyers on it, so that they understand the litigants and the issues that come before them. As someone who practices law in this state, and I go into courts, it's deadly for a lawyer and for the clients the lawyer represents to have a judge that does not know what the lawyer's talking about; to have a judge that does not know the issues. Now this Constitutional Amendment will not ensure that every judge can do that, but it will eliminate a whole lot of 'would be' judges who have had one and two and three years experience, perhaps not in trial law. Perhaps they have three years experience being a glorified paralegal in somebody's office and they sneak through the system, and they become a judge. These people are not qualified to be judges. So, this proposal will weed out at least some, it will increase the odds that those who are elected to the judiciary are quality judges 21 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994 with sufficient experience to understand the issues before them. This is critical legislation to make our judiciary better, and I would recommend an 'aye' vote."
"Representative Santiago."
"Thank you, Mr. Speaker and Members of the General Assembly. I rise in opposition to this Constitutional Amendment. I think what's going to happen here; two years ago we passed legislation to divide Cook County into sub-circuits to allow blacks, hispanics, woman, and other minorities an opportunity to elect some of those individuals to the judiciary. For example, before the sub-circuits were formed in Cook County we only had four hispanic judges that were appointed. Right now because of the election of a year ago, that number increased to six. This past election, this past election three other hispanics were elected. So, which proves what we did here two years ago is working. It's working because it gave those communities an opportunity to elect one of their own. But, to come and ask, and say that we must now have qualifications of being a lawyer for ten years in order to become a judge, I think is wrong because what this is just going to hurt, it's going to hurt the blacks, it's going to hurt the hispanic, it's going to hurt the woman. The average hispanic lawyer has less than seven years experience, and the average black lawyer has maybe ten, eleven years experience, and how did, how did this happen? It has happened because of the history of the different law schools that refuse to give minorities an opportunity to get into law school. We have seen minorities in the last maybe ten or 12 years, accepted by law school. That's why as a result we do not have many lawyers to have a lot of experience, but to say that you need ten years of 22 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994 experience to say that you need 20 years of experience, will, I know a lot of lawyers that have 15 and 20 years experience, but they still do not know the law, and they cannot even get you out of jail in a monopoly game, because they're SO incompetent. So, to select and say, select an arbitrary number and say, 'Well you must have ten years, 12 years experience, that is ridiculous'. It is ridiculous because you do not need to have ten, 15 years. All you need to do is be competent in the law. There's a lot of lawyers, a lot of attorneys that have never gone before a court. These are individuals that write briefs, they write briefs for the judges, they write briefs for the appellate court, and these are the smartest individuals in the judiciary. That does not mean anything, that you must have ten years experience. We do not ask the Governor of the State of Illinois to have, to spend ten years in the Legislature before he could run for office. We do not ask the state treasurer of this state to be a banker before, to have ten years as a banker before he runs for state treasury. We do not ask the Secretary of State to have ten years experience, we do not ask other individuals for these qualifications, why, why, we're just targeting this Bill along and it's supported by the CBA, the CBA is supporting this because they're losing control. They're losing control now because blacks and hispanics and woman, they've bypassing the CBA, and they're taking their complaints directly to the voters. So, the CBA now is saying, 'Wait a minute', there's something wrong. We must abolish this system. We must abolish this system that is giving the blacks, hispanics and woman an opportunity to get elected'. That's why the CBA is for this, the same CBA that never, never gave blacks and hispanic and woman an opportunity to 23 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994 help them to become associate judges. We had a system, we had a system which said, 'Let's appoint individuals.' Well, we proved that, that system is inconsistent, it's unfair because the numbers will tell you. Under the old system, hispanics there are only four hispanic judges, in the last 45 years in the state, in Cook County. The same thing with blacks, blacks are only a few, a handful of blacks because they use the old system. Now, now we learn the rules of the game. We learn the rules of the game, and now they're saying, 'Well, we're going to change the game'. We're going to adopt other rules so that you, you could go back, you could go back and say, 'Well the system doesn't work'. Well, let me tell you the Republican side, let me give you the political ramifications of this. Why is this being put on now? This is being put on now, SO that you could have the blacks and hispanics come out, and woman come out in large numbers, and they're basically Democrats, they're basically Democrats, and once you get them out, you know where they're going to vote, they're going to vote straight Democratic, which is going to hurt the Republicans; and especially Cook County. So, I ask the Republicans on that side that voted with us two years ago in a coalition, in a coalition to be fair, to be fair to minorities in Cook County, but just remember what I just mentioned. This is going to bring blacks, hispanics out and woman a large numbers in November, and you know whose going to get hurt. Not the Democrats; the Republicans. So, keep that in your mind. I also would, before I..."
"Mr. Santiago, just a minute please. Representative Madigan."
"Mr. Speaker, I'd like to make two points. Number one, it was only a few years ago that Chester Blair served as 24 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994 the President of the Chicago Bar Association. Mr. Blair is a black person, and number two, I offered this because I think we ought to have better than the average serving as judges in this state, that's my purpose. I think we might have better than average, but at this time I'd like to take this out of the record, Mr. Speaker."
"Thank you. We'll take this out of the record. Appearing on Second Reading. Mr. Johnson, Tim Johnson are you seeking recognition?" Johnson, Tim: "I was, but wisdom of the Sponsor prevails."
"Okay. Mr. Flinn, Monroe Flinn, House Bill 3329. Representative Flinn. Representative Deering, 3611. Where's Mr. Deering? Read the Bill, Mr. Clerk."
"House Bill 3611, a Bill for an Act amending the Illinois Banking Act. Second Reading of the Bill. No Committee Amendments. No Floor Amendments."
"Third Reading. Representative Santiago, 3798. Out of the record. Civil Law, Second Reading. Mr. Lang, House Bill 2428, both of them out of the record. Representative Flowers, 2650. Representative von Bergen-Wessels. If the staff could move, I could see the Lady. House Bill 2809, 2809. Out of the record. Representative Kotlarz, 2822, Kotlarz. Representative Burke, 2849. Read the Bill, Mr. Clerk."
"House Bill 2849, a Bill for an Act concerning motor vehicle theft. Second Reading of the Bill. No Committee Amendments. Floor Amendment #1."
"Representative Burke, Amendment #1 has been filed, is not printed. What is your desire, Sir?"
"Mr. Speaker, I would move to table the Amendment."
"Gentleman moves to table Amendment #1. All in favor say 'aye'; opposed, 'no'. The 'ayes' have it. The 25 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day Motion is adopted. Amendment is tabled. Further Amendments?"
"No further Amendments, but a fiscal note has been requested on the Bill."
"Mr. Lang."
"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The front of the Bill clearly says that there's no fiscal impact. I think the request for a fiscal note is dilatory, and I would ask the Chair to so rule."
"Mr. Black."
"Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. To the Gentleman's request to the Chair. Anytime a legislative Body creates a reporting act..."
"Mr. Black."
"Yes."
"The Chair is going to rule that the request is not dilatory."
"Thank you."
"No, it's not dilatory. The fiscal note request will have to be honored. So, Mr. Burke, you'll have to get a fiscal note filed. It stays on Second Reading. Representative Dart, 3094. Mr. Dart, 3094. Read the Bill, Mr. Clerk."
"House Bill 3094, a Bill for an Act amending the Illinois Vehicle Code. Second Reading of the Bill. No Committee Amendments. No Floor Amendments."
"Third Reading. House Bill 3325, Representative Wojcik. Out of the record. Representative Flinn, 3330. Mr. Hartke, 3345. Read the Bill, Mr. Clerk."
"House Bill 3345, a Bill for an Act amending the Liquor Control Act of 1934. Second Reading of the Bill. No Committee Amendments. No Floor Amendments." 26 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994
"Third Reading. Representative Mautino, 3346. Mr. Mautino, out of the record. Representative Schakowsky, 3353. Mr. Schakowsky here? Representative Currie, 3354. Read the Bill, Mr. Clerk."
"House Bill 3354, a Bill for an Act amending the Illinois Marriage and Dissolution of Marriage Act. Second Reading of the Bill. Amendment #1 was adopted in committee. No Motions filed. No Floor Amendments. A fiscal note has been requested on the Bill."
"Representative Currie, you have a fiscal note. Ms. Currie."
"There's no cost to State Government on this particular proposal, so I would ask the Chair to rule the fiscal Note Act request is dilatory."
"Mr. Clerk, would you hand us the Bill, please? Mr. Black on Representative Currie, Mr. Black. Representative Black, on Representative Curries' point of order."
"Yes, thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. I would simply object to her point. If you read the Bill, and the Attorney General and the courts of the State of Illinois are involved, Public Aid is involved, child support is involved. I don't know how anybody could say there is no cost to this, because it is in the court system, and there is going to definitely be a cost to State Government. Unless, you're going to have volunteers go around and pick up these kids and make these determinations, there has to be a legal, legal machinery to carry out the, the responsibilities of the Bill.
"Mr. Ryder."
"Mr. Speaker, I stand in support of Mr. Black's position. How anyone can say that anything that involves the court, 27 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994 doesn't have a fiscal impact, obviously hasn't been to court recently? It costs money everytime you turn around and one of the reasons we have Bills, just like this is because it costs money. Now it could very well be that the intent of this Bill is such, that it's going to have a positive effect on the amount of money that it costs to go to court these days. I don't know, but that's just the point. We don't know, that's why we're asking for a fiscal note. That's why we believe that the people of the State of Illinois have a right to know what is this going to cost? The Representatives in this Body have a right to know what it is going to cost?"
"All right, Mr. Ryder. The Chair is going to agree with your, with your point. So, the Bill stays on Second Reading. Ms. Currie."
"The people who are, the subject of this Bill are the parents and a child. The Attorney General plays no role. It's my understanding the court costs are picked up by the parties to this kind of custodial or other hearing. It is an outrage to think that what this Bill is about is increasing any penny of cost to Illinois State Government. It merely establishes a different standard when cases are already in court. So, even if the issue, where there were new cases in court this Bill doesn't change a thing, and secondly, that the costs are born by the parties in court, the parents, rather than by the state. So, I would move since the Chair will not rule that the Fiscal Note Act is inapplicable to House Bill 3354."
"All right, on the Lady's Motion, all those in favor vote 'aye'; opposed vote 'no'. Have all voted? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? The Clerk will take the record. On this 28 117th Legislative Day STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE April 19, 1994 Motion, there are 64 'ayes', 52 'noes', and the Motion carries. Third Reading. Representative Flowers, on 3410. Ms. Flowers. Representative Hartke, 3522. Read the Bill, Mr. Clerk."
"House Bill 3522, a Bill for an Act amending the Motor Vehicle Franchise Act. Second Reading of the Bill. No Committee Amendments. No Floor Amendments."
"Third Reading. Mr. Hartke."
"You know I was surprised you got to mine before you did Representative Ronen's Bill, did you skip her?"
"Mr. Black."
"Inquiry of the Chair. Is there an Amendment filed to this Bill?"
"No, it's on Third Reading. No Amendments filed."
"I thought it was on Second Reading?"
"Well, I just moved it to Third Reading, because there are no Amendments filed."
"All right."
"Representative Daniels."
"Mr. Speaker, maybe you could indulge us by asking the Clerk if there is an Amendment sitting at his desk on this Bill that he has yet to receive and record?"
"Yes, the Clerk looked at me and said there were no Amendments filed."
"Is there an Amendment in the well there, Mr. Clerk."
"Mr. Clerk, are there any Amendments filed to this Bill?"
"There are no Amendments filed to this Bill."
"That is not the question, Sir. The question is, is there an Amendment in the well, waiting for him to recognize that it's been filed, sitting there, and not yet 29 117th Legislative Day STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE April 19, 1994 numbered and excepted by him?"
"Mr. Clerk."
"No."
"Representative Daniels, there are no Amendments filed to this Bill."
"Okay."
"Representative Brunsvold, on 3549. Read the Bill, Mr. Clerk."
"House Bill 3549, a Bill for an Act in relation to firearms shooting ranges. Second Reading of the Bill. No Committee Amendments."
"Are there any Amendments filed, Mr. Clerk?"
"A Floor Amendment has been filed to this Bill."
"All right, what's the Amendment? Amendment #1."
"Floor Amendment #1, offered by Representative Persico."
"All right is the Amendment printed?"
"The Amendment has not been printed."
"Representative Brunsvold."
"I move to table the Amendment, Mr. Speaker."
"The Gentleman moves to table Amendment #1, all those in favor say 'aye'; opposed, 'no'. The 'ayes' have it, the Amendments, the Motion is adopted. Further Amendments?"
"No further Amendments, but a fiscal note has been requested on the Bill."
"All right, a fiscal note has been requested on the Bill. Representative Daniels."
"Now it's my understanding that on that Bill there is an Amendment that was filed this morning, and you've just moved to table an Amendment that's properly been filed by a Member of this House. Is that correct? Is that Motion put 30 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994 to you, and put to this Body, and you'd pass by a voice vote, is that correct, Sir?"
"That is absolutely correct, because there was none seeking recognition, Sir. No one was seeking recognition."
"Mr. Speaker, it is recognized that when a Member files a Bill in this House and an Amendment, he has a right to have that heard. And, there's a number of Bills up there right now. Now, are you telling us what you're going to do is entertain Motions that table Bills, because you say you can't keep up with the paperwork of this House on behalf of the people of Illinois."
"Well."
"Is that what you're telling us by your action, and what are you going to do when big Bills come up that maybe important to you? Of course, you're going to delay the process until you get your legislation heard, because your district may have a greater importance than somebody else's district, or someone else's legislation. Now what is it you're going to do? You're going to allow Members to have their Amendments printed and heard?"
"What the Chair is going to do is abide by the rules. Mr. Brunsvold, under our rules, made a Motion to table. No one was seeking recognition on his Motion and we passed it on a voice vote. If anyone was seeking recognition, the Chair would have recognized that individual."
"It is your responsibility to make sure that legislation is moved in an orderly fashion and that when you receive Amendments that this Clerk of the House, operating on behalf of the people of Illinois, receives the Amendment, allows them to be printed. Now what is it that the Members 31 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994 of this House feel about that? How do you feel about your legislation being run over and ignored? Now, what is it you want from us?"
"Representative Brunsvold, a request for a fiscal note has been filed on your Bill. Mr. Brunsvold."
"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'd like to move that the fiscal note is not applicable to this Bill."
"All right, on the Gentleman's Motion, Representative Ryder."
"I wish to question the Sponsor on his Motion, if I may please."
"Yes, proceed."
"Mr. Brunsvold, what is it exactly that the underlying Bill is intended to do."
"The Bill would address a situation that really has existed in the agriculture community where farms are being moved into, close to, by housing developments. The farm has been there forever and the housing development files notes to the EPA, because of the smell and things like that, when the farm was there to begin with. Similar situations exists in shooting and hunting areas, where the hunting area and shooting area has been there for years, and years, and a situation exists where the, the growth of housing developments comes up close to a shooting area or hunting area, and actually tries to eliminate the hunting area that's been there for years. Trying to give it protection against some noise, noise regulations."
"Representative, it sounds to me as if the Bill that you; re describing is one that would probably encourage a lot of support on this side of the aisle. In fact, it sounds like the kind of Bill that could be good government. But, in addition to that we have some questions about good 32 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994 government, and that's the concern that I have here. From your description of the Bill, it appears that we could be doing something that, that creates judicial impact. You talked about potential EPA involvement, you talked about law enforcement involvement, you talked about a number of things that you're trying to clarify. I would suggest to you, Sir, that your Motion about the fiscal note is probably ill-advised because we'll be involved in a conversation that avoids the substance, and we're talking about the procedure. It is impossible for me to believe that there is not some fiscal impact. I believe that if I knew that fiscal impact, I would probably still be in support of the Bill, because the merits out weight the cost. I can't, I can't however make that decision until such time as I know the cost. I would like to support the Bill, the environment in which you find your Bill being called 'the luck of the call', if you will, put you smack dab in the middle of an event, and when you would then ask that the fiscal note be made inapplicable, it compounds the problem. I would ask your indulgence, Sir, to reconsider your Motion, otherwise, we're going to have to continue to discuss this issue, this merit, this procedure, and I for one would not like to harm the Bill that you have underlined; because I think it has merits. I hope you understand that which I'm trying to say."
"Who, who would you suggest that I get this fiscal note from?"
"I would suggest that you get them from just exactly the folks that you mentioned in your explanations, Sir."
"Who would that be, the Department of Conservation?"
"That's the first place I would go; Department of EPA would be the second." 33 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994
"Well, the EPA really wouldn't have, well, noise pollution possibly."
"Possibly. I think that those would be the folks that you would go to. I would be happy to work with you on that if you meet some resistance, but truthfully, the substance of the Bill sounds meritorious to me, but the problem with the, the manner in which it's being considered, causes us great concern."
"The fact is, Representative Ryder, that this Bill, if it were to pass and be signed by the Governor, would go into, to the states' statutes, and there it would sit with that language of protecting the shooting ranges and hunting clubs, which our own state hunting areas, by the way, are included here. Sitting there saying that they can't be encroached on by, and be removed by, by development of housing areas, et cetera. That's all it would do."
"Representative, I understand the substance of the Bill, as to the merit of it, I think you and I both reached an accord. My concern is, take it to the agency, it's my hope they come back and they say that it adds zero cost, that's my hope, because if it is, you've matched the requirements under the laws of this Body, and then I think that you got a Bill that I'd be happy to support."
"Would you be happy with the Department of Conservation? We'll let them look at it; would that be sufficient?"
"I'm sorry, I didn't hear that?"
"Would the Department of Conservation be sufficient?"
"The part about the EPA and the noise is the only other consideration. I would think that there would be no more than those two, Sir."
"Thank you. I withdraw the Motion." 34 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day
"All April 19, 1994 right, the Gentleman withdraws the Motion. Mr. Brunsvold, they've also asked for note, as of about a minute ago."
"A mandates note?" a state mandates
"Yes."
"That does not apply to this Bill."
"Well, it appears like that's going to be withdrawn. The mandates note request will be withdrawn, and the fiscal note."
"Mandates note."
"And the fiscal note. Just a fiscal note. Just a fiscal note."
"Thank you, Mr. Speaker."
"Representative Daniels."
"Mr. Speaker we're going to request a Republican caucus immediately."
"The Chair is prepared to adjourn. Do you want to meet upon adjournment? We'd like to make this Motion on a posting."
"That's fine."
"All right. Motion." Representative Granberg, on a I move to suspend Rule 20 to posting requirements for House
"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. allow the, to waive the Bills 2478, 2479, 2524, 2655, 3623, 3749, 4156, 4157, 4158, 4173, 4174, 4176, 4177, 4178, 4182, 4184, 4185, 4186, 4187, 4188, 4189, 4191, 4192, 4193, 4199, 4200, 4201, 4203, 4206, 4207, 4210, 4211, 4213, 4214, 4215, 4216, 4217, 4218, 4219, 4220, 4223 to be heard in the appropriate committee."
"All right, you heard the Gentleman's Motion. Is there any objections to the Gentleman's Motion? There are no objections, the Attendance Roll Call will be used on the 35 117th Legislative Day STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE April 19, 1994 Motion, and the Motion carries. All right, the Chair is prepared to adjourn, momentarily. Are there any announcements? Except the Republicans have requested a caucus. Are there any announcements? Speaker Madigan."
"Mr. Speaker for two announcements. Number one, today's a sad day because it's my birthday, and at my age, why you're trying to forget about these things, and we'd like to announce that there'll be some birthday cake in the Speakers Conference Room momentarily. Second, we'd like to announce that tomorrow about noon we will call Governor Edgar's Assault Weapon Bill again. So, the Bill offered by Governor Edgar that would ban assault weapons will be called tomorrow about noon. Thank you, Mr. Speaker."
"Representative Hicks."
"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I guess the question of the Chair, if in fact that the Republicans are going to caucus in 118. My committee meets at 2:00 in 118, I guess I have a question to whether or not they'll be through by 2:00, and if I need to move my committee room in order to accommodate?"
"Representative Black, can you answer that? Mr. Black. All right, Mr. Black."
"Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. Inquiry of the Chair."
"Yes."
"It's my understanding that House Bill 3881 was to have been on the salmon colored sheet, that notice was filed in the timely fashion, and filed with the knowledge and support of the chairman of the appropriate committee, and your side of the aisle. Perhaps it was just left off by accident?"
"Put that on the board, on a Motion. What was the Bill number, Mr. Black?" 36 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day
"House Bill 3881."
"What committee?"
"Revenue Committee." April 19, 1994
"House Bill 3881 (sic-3831), Revenue Committee. Mr. Levin, is that correct, do you agree with the Motion? Mr. Levin."
"Yes, I agree with the Motion."
"Yes, the question is, 'Shall..."
"(House Bill) 3881."
"(House Bill) 3881. All right, has it been cleared by both sides of the aisle? Mr. Black moves to suspend the posting requirements for House Bill 3881. All those in favor say 'aye'; opposed, 'no'. The 'ayes' have it. Using Attendance Roll Call, the Motion carries. Mr. Hartke: Hartke." "Well, thank you very much. I think Representative Hicks has a question about the committee room. I would like to start my committee promptly at 2:00. So, if they can finish by then, I would appreciate it, too."
"Are you in Room 118, also?"
"No, I'm in Room 114, but it's scheduled at 2:00."
"Well, you don't have a problem. Mr. Novak."
"Yes, Mr. Speaker. An announcement. On committee tomorrow with the Housing and Environment Energy Committee will meet at 4:00 p.m. on the House floor; 4:00 p.m. on the House floor."
"All right, thank you. Representative Daniels, can you answer Mr. Hicks question? Can you answer Mr. Hicks question; will you be finished by 2:00 p.m., or should he have his committee in another room?"
"We'll do our best to be finished by 2:00, we think it will just be short." 37 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day
"All April 19, 1994 right. All right, Representative Granberg now moves that the House stands... State Operations, Second Reading, House Bill 2612. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill."
"House Bill 2612, a Bill for an act amending the Criminal Code of 1961. Second Reading of the Bill. No Committee Amendments. Floor Amendment #1, offered by
Speaker Madigan."
"Amendment #1 is withdrawn. Further Amendments?"
"Floor Amendment #2, offered by Representative Daniels."
"All right, the Sponsor wanted this Bill read a second time today and held on Second Reading, and it will so be done. We are now prepared to adjourn. Representative Granberg moves that the House stands. Mr. Daniels, are you seeking recognition?"
"No, just repeating our request for Republican conference immediately."
"All right, thank you. Representative Granberg now moves, allowing the Clerk perfunctory time, the House stands adjourned until tomorrow at the hour of 12:00 noon. All in favor say 'aye'; opposed, 'no'. The 'ayes' have it, and the House stands adjourned. There's a Republican caucus immediately in Room 118."
"Introduction - First Reading of House Bills. House Bill 4236, offered by Representative Capparelli, a Bill for an Act to amend the State Mandates Act. House Bill 4237, offered by Representative McAuliffe, a Bill for an Act to amend the Illinois Pension Code. House Bill 4238, offered by Representative McAuliffe, a Bill for an Act to amend the Illinois Pension Code. House Bill 4239, offered by Representative Rutherford, a Bill for an Act concerning health care, amending named Acts. House Bill 4240, offered 38 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day April 19, 1994 by Representative Cowlishaw, a Bill for an Act to amend the Downstate Forest Preserve District Act. House Bill 4241, offered by Representative Lindner, a Bill for an Act to amend the Criminal Code. First Reading of these House Bills."
"Introduction - First Reading of Senate Bills. Senate Bill 1670, offered by Representative Stephens, a Bill for an Act to amend the Bi-State Development Powers Act. Senate Bill 1672, offered by Representative Flinn, a Bill for an Act to amend the Illinois Municipal Code. Senate Bill 1692, offered by Representative Black, a Bill for an Act to amend the Illinois Development Finance Authority Act. Senate Bill 1693, offered by Representative Black, a Bill for an Act in relation to a memorial for Korean War veterans. Senate Bill 1700, offered by Representative Daniels, a Bill for an Act to amend the Riverboat Gambling Act. Senate Bill 1704, offered by Representative Ryder, a Bill for an Act to amend the Lead Poisoning Prevention Act. Senate Bill 1707, offered by Representative Cross, a Bill for an Act to amend the Criminal Code of 1961. Senate Bill 1708, offered by Representative Black, a Bill for an Act to create the Illinois Conservation Foundation. Senate Bill 1711, offered by Representative McPike, a Bill for an Act to amend the Lobbyist Registration Act. Senate Bill 1712, offered by Representative Deuchler, a Bill for an Act to amend the Minority and Female Business Enterprise Act. Senate Bill 1714, offered by Representative Salvi, a Bill for an Act to amend the Unified Code of corrections. Senate Bill 1718, offered by Representative Tim Johnson, a Bill for an Act to create the University of Illinois Hospital Services Fund. Senate Bill 1719, offered by Representative Salvi, a Bill 39 117th Legislative Day STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE April 19, 1994 for an Act to amend the Firearm Owner's Identification Act. Senate Bill 1720, offered by Representative Lindner, a Bill for an Act for the conveyance of certain real property owned by the State. Senate Bill 1722, offered by Representative Saviano, a Bill for an Act to amend the Intergovernmental Drug Laws Enforcement Act. Senate Bill 454, offered by Representative Biggert, a Bill for an Act concerning interstate family support. Senate Bill 1149, offered by Representative, a Bill for an Act to amend the State Mandates Act. Senate Bill 1153, offered by Representative Tom Johnson, a Bill for an Act to amend the Criminal Code of 1961. Senate Bill 1165, offered by Representative Granberg, a Bill for an Act to amend the Illinois Public Aid Code. Senate Bill 1206, offered by Representative McAuliffe, a Bill for an Act relating to police officers and firefighters. Senate Bill 1302, offered by Representative Balthis, a Bill for an Act to amend the Illinois Municipal Code. Senate Bill 1319, offered by Representative Tenhouse, a Bill for an Act to amend the Hospital District Law. Senate Bill 1328, offered by Representative Churchill, a Bill for an Act to amend the Liquor Control Act of 1934. Senate Bill 1365, offered by Representative Kubik, a Bill for an Act in relation to State tax revenues. Senate Bill 1726, offered by Representative Walsh, a Bill for an Act to amend the Illinois Lottery Law. Senate Bill 1729, offered by Representative Lindner, a Bill for an Act in relation to support responsibilities and paternity. Senate Bill 1803, offered by Representative Churchill, a Bill for an Act concerning extension and removal of repealers. Senate Bill 1182, offered by Representative Granberg, a Bill for an Act relating to the provisions of financial services of state 40 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 117th Legislative Day owned properties. Senate Bill April 19, 1994 1251, offered by Representative Granberg, a Bill for an Act to amend the Snowmobile Registration and Safety Act. Senate Bill 1297, offered by Representative Giolitto, a Bill for an Act concerning toll bridges. Senate Bill 1384, offered by Representative Prussing, a Bill for an Act to amend certain Acts in relation to certain state finance. Senate Bill 1468, offered by Representative Giolitto, a Bill for an Act concerning the reproduction of business records. Senate Bill 1717, offered by Representative Granberg, a Bill for an Act to amend the Statewide Grand Jury Act. Senate Bill 1125, offered by Representative Granberg, a Bill for an Act to amend the Criminal Code of 1961. Senate Bill 1191, offered by Representative Hughes, a Bill for an Act to amend the Property Tax Code. Senate Bill 1232, offered by Representative Homer, a Bill for an Act to amend the Code of criminal procedure of 1963. Senate Bill 1233, offered by Representative Homer, a Bill for an Act to amend the Unified Code of corrections. Senate Bill 1285, offered by Representative Granberg, a Bill for an Act to amend the Counties Code. Senate Bill 1346, offered by Representative Lang, a Bill for an Act to amend the Burial Rights Act. Senate Bill 1437, offered by Representative Granberg, a Bill for an Act to amend the Code of civil procedure. Senate Bill 1454, offered by Representative Granberg, a Bill for an Act to revise the law by combining multiple enactments and making technical corrections. Senate Bill 1455, offered by Representative Granberg, a Bill for an Act to revise the law by combining multiple enactments and making technical corrections. Senate Bill 1457, offered by Representative Granberg, a Bill for an Act relating to the medicaid clause saving suggestion award program. Senate 41 117th Legislative Day STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE April 19, 1994 Bill 1502, offered by Representative Turner, a Bill for an Act to amend the Hospital Licensing Act. Senate Bill 1545, offered by Representative Granberg, a Bill for an Act to amend the Code of civil procedure. Senate Bill 1558, offered by Representative Granberg, a Bill for an Act amending the Consumer Fraud and Deceptive Practices Act. Senate Bill 1610, offered by Representative Dart, a Bill for an Act to amend the Code of Civil Procedure. Introduction and First Reading of these Bills."
"Introduction - First Reading of House Bills. House Bill 4242, offered by Representative Pugh, a Bill for an Act to amend the Property Tax Code. First Reading of this House Bill."
"Being no further business, the House will stand adjourned until Wednesday, April 20, 1994 at the hour of 12:00 noon." 42 REPORT: TIFLDAY PAGE: 001 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES DAILY TRANSCRIPTION OF DEBATE INDEX APRIL 19, 1994 94/05/03 11:13:02 HB-2564 SECOND READING PAGE 7 HB-2612 SECOND READING PAGE 38 HB-2795 SECOND READING PAGE 7 HB-2795 MOTION PAGE 8 HB-2849 SECOND READING PAGE 25 HB-2849 HELD ON SECOND PAGE 26 HB-2962 SECOND READING PAGE 14 HB-2962 HELD ON SECOND PAGE 16 HB-3082 SECOND READING PAGE 16 HB-3082 HELD ON SECOND PAGE 16 HB-3094 SECOND READING PAGE 26 HB-3345 SECOND READING PAGE 26 HB-3354 SECOND READING PAGE 27 HB-3354 HELD ON SECOND PAGE 28 HB-3522 SECOND READING PAGE 29 HB-3531 SECOND READING PAGE 13 HB-3549 SECOND READING PAGE 30 HB-3549 MOTION PAGE 32 HB-3611 SECOND READING PAGE 25 HB-3623 MOTION PAGE 3 HB-3623 OUT OF RECORD PAGE 4 HB-3624 SECOND READING PAGE 13 HB-3881 MOTION PAGE 37 HB-3913 SECOND READING PAGE 14 HB-3913 OUT OF RECORD PAGE 14 HB-4211 MOTION PAGE 3 HB-4211 OUT OF RECORD PAGE 4 HB-4236 FIRST READING PAGE 38 HB-4237 FIRST READING PAGE 38 HB-4238 FIRST READING PAGE 38 HB-4239 FIRST READING PAGE 38 HB-4240 FIRST READING PAGE 38 HB-4241 FIRST READING PAGE 39 HB-4242 FIRST READING PAGE 42 SB-0454 FIRST READING PAGE 40 SB-1125 FIRST READING PAGE 41 SB-1149 FIRST READING PAGE 40 SB-1153 FIRST READING PAGE 40 SB-1165 FIRST READING PAGE 40 SB-1182 FIRST READING PAGE 40 SB-1191 FIRST READING PAGE 41 SB-1206 FIRST READING PAGE 40 SB-1232 FIRST READING PAGE 41 SB-1233 FIRST READING PAGE 41 SB-1251 FIRST READING PAGE 41 SB-1285 FIRST READING PAGE 41 SB-1297 FIRST READING PAGE 41 SB-1302 FIRST READING PAGE 40 SB-1319 FIRST READING PAGE 40 SB-1326 FIRST READING PAGE 41 SB-1328 FIRST READING PAGE 40 SB-1346 FIRST READING PAGE 41 SB-1365 FIRST READING PAGE 40 SB-1384 FIRST READING PAGE 41 SB-1437 FIRST READING PAGE 41 SB-1454 FIRST READING PAGE 41 SB-1455 FIRST READING PAGE 41 SB-1457 FIRST READING PAGE 41 SB-1468 FIRST READING PAGE 41 SB-1502 FIRST READING PAGE 42 SB-1545 FIRST READING PAGE 42 SB-1558 FIRST READING PAGE 42 SB-1610 FIRST READING PAGE 42 SB-1670 FIRST READING PAGE 39 REPORT: TIFLDAY PAGE: 002 STATE OF ILLINOIS 88TH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES DAILY TRANSCRIPTION OF DEBATE INDEX APRIL 19, 1994 94/05/03 11:13:02 SB-1672 FIRST READING PAGE 39 SB-1692 FIRST READING PAGE 39 SB-1693 FIRST READING PAGE 39 SB-1700 FIRST READING PAGE 39 SB-1704 FIRST READING PAGE 39 SB-1707 FIRST READING PAGE 39 SB-1708 FIRST READING PAGE 39 SB-1711 FIRST READING PAGE 39 SB-1712 FIRST READING PAGE 39 SB-1714 FIRST READING PAGE 39 SB-1717 FIRST READING PAGE 41 SB-1719 FIRST READING PAGE 39 SB-1720 FIRST READING PAGE 40 SB-1722 FIRST READING PAGE 40 SB-1726 FIRST READING PAGE 40 SB-1729 FIRST READING PAGE 40 SB-1803 FIRST READING PAGE 40 *HJR-0031 THIRD READING PAGE 17 *HJR-0031 OUT OF RECORD PAGE 25 *HJR-0035 THIRD READING PAGE 5 SUBJECT MATTER HOUSE TO ORDER SPEAKER MCPIKE PAGE 1 PRAYER REVEREND EDWARD MCGHEE PAGE 1 PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE PAGE 1 ROLL CALL ATTENDANCE PAGE 1 COMMITTEE REPORTS PAGE 2 MESSAGES FROM SENATE PAGE 2 HOUSE ADJOURNED PAGE 38 PERFUNCTORY SESSION PAGE 38 PERFUNCTORY SESSION ADJOURNED PAGE 42