Illinois House Floor Debate — March 25, 2003

"The House shall come to order. The Members shall be in their chairs. We shall be led in prayer today by Bishop Lloyd Gwin of the Church of the Living God in Champaign. Bishop Gwin is the guest of Representative Naomi Jakobsson. The guests in the gallery may wish to rise and join us for the invocation and the Pledge of Allegiance.”

"We shall be led in the Pledge of Allegiance by Representative Jakobsson.” Jakobsson – et al: “I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.”

"Roll Call for Attendance. Representative Currie.”

"Thank you, Speaker. Please let the record show that Representative McKeon is excused today. And Representative Flider is with us now but he may have to leave us early for important activities in his district later this afternoon.”

"Mr. Bost.”

"The Clerk shall take the record. There being 115 Members responding to the Attendance Roll Call, there is a quorum present. Mr. Clerk.”

"Mr. Clerk, House Resolution 34. Mr. Clerk on House Resolution 34. Read the Resolution.”

"You’ve all heard the Resolution. On the Resolution, the Chair recognizes Mr. Eddy.”

"State your point.”

"Mr. Jefferson.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I rise for point of personal privilege.”

"State your point.”

"I’d just like to take this opportunity to recognize my secretary, who is retiring at the end of April, who’s been there for 28 years. And for most of those 28 years she was the secretary of the late, great ‘Zeke’ Giorgi. So, if she will stand, please. Ms. Eleanor Winlock. Be retiring in April. I also want to recognize her replacement who is the ‘J.Lo’ of Rockford, Margaret Cadillo. Margaret, stand up. Margaret is gonna be replacing her. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.” 09300034.doc 5  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Ladies and Gentlemen, on the Order of House Resolution 34, Mr. Eddy moves for the adoption of the Resolution. Those in favor say ‘yes’; those opposed say ‘no’. The ‘ayes’ have it. The Resolution is adopted. The Chair recognizes Mr. Froehlich.”

"State your point.”

"Mr… Mr. Delgado.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Personal privilege.”

"State your point.”

"We… since we have so many heroes up in our gallery I didn’t want anyone left… felt left out here. We want to also welcome… we have quite a few members up there in blue. A lot of heroes that come out and fight our fires every day. We have the Associated Firefighters Association here along with Local 2. And we just want to say welcome to the Capitol and good luck on your conference.”

"Mr. Black. Mr. Black, you are the Sponsor of House Bill 3488, on the Order of Second Reading. Did you wish to move the Bill? Mr. Clerk, what is the status of the Bill?” 09300034.doc 6  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Third Reading. Mr. Hoffman, you are the Sponsor of House Bill 3411, on the Order of Third Reading. Do you wish to call the Bill? Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Mr. Hoffman.”

"Yes, all this… all this would do is would provide that upon expiration… The Bi-State Development Agency is made up of individuals from both sides of the river, St. Louis, Missouri and… the St. Louis area and Illinois. The agency oversees the mass transportation components in Missouri and Illinois. It is fed… it is a federal entity that was put together by Federal Law. However, locally you can determine how the appointments are made. And this just indicates the beginning with the appointment to be filled of January 2004 and at the expiration of each term of the current commissioners, the chairman of the county board of St. Clair County, as opposed to the Governor, shall make appointments… two of the appointments and the chairman of the Madison County shall make the other two appointments.”

"The Gentleman moves for the passage of the Bill. Is there any discussion? There being no discussion, the question is, ‘Shall this Bill pass?’ Those in favor 09300034.doc 7  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed by voting ‘no’. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? The Clerk shall take the record. On this question, there are 114 people voting ‘yes’; 0 voting ‘no’. This Bill, having received a Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. Mr. Wait, did you wish to call House Bill 1548? The Gentleman indicates he does not wish to call the Bill. Mr. Watson. Is Mr. Watson in the chamber? Did you wish to call House Bill 3001? Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Mr. Watson.”

"The Gentleman moves for the passage of the Bill. Is there any discussion? There being no discussion, the question is, ‘Shall this Bill pass?’ Those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed by voting ‘no’. The Clerk shall take the record. On this question, there are 09300034.doc 8  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 115 people voting ‘yes’, 0 voting ‘no’. This Bill, having received a Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. Is Mr. McGuire in the chamber? Mr. McGuire? Mr. Novak, you are the Sponsor of House Bill 360, on the Order of Second Reading. Did you wish to move the Bill? The Gentleman indicates he does not wish to call the Bill. Is Mr. Lang in the chamber? Mr. Lang, you are the Sponsor of House Bill 89. Did you wish to move the Bill? The Gentleman indicates he does not wish to move the Bill. Representative Kelly, you are the Sponsor of House Bill 1415. Did you wish to move the Bill? The Lady indicates she does not wish to move the Bill. Mr. Flider, you are the Sponsor of House Bill 3048. Did you wish to move the Bill? Mr. Clerk, read the Bill. Mr. Clerk, what is the status of House Bill 3048? Clerk advises that there’s a request for a note, which has not been complied with. So the Bill shall remain on the Order of Second Reading. Mr. Dunkin, the Gentleman from Chicago, you are the Sponsor of House Bill 3429. 3—4-2-9. Do you wish to move the Bill? The Gentleman indicates he does not wish to move the Bill. Mr. Franks in the chamber? You are the Sponsor of House Bill 209. Do you wish to move the Bill? The Gentleman indicates he does not wish to move the Bill. Mr. Granberg. Is Mr. Granberg in the chamber? Mr. Mitchell. Mr. Jerry Mitchell. You are the Sponsor of House Bill 2352. Do you wish to move the Bill? The Gentleman indicates he does not wish to call the Bill. Mr. Schmitz. Is Mr. Schmitz in the chamber? You are the Sponsor of House Bill 92. Do you 09300034.doc 9  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 wish to call the Bill? Mr. Clerk, what is the status of House Bill 92?”

"Mr. Schmitz.”

"The Gentleman moves for the adoption of the Amendment. Is there any discussion? There being no discussion, the question is, ‘Shall the Amendment be adopted?’ Those in favor say ‘yes’; those opposed say ‘no’. The ‘ayes’ have it. The Amendment is adopted. Are there any further Amendments?”

"Put the Bill on the Order of Third Reading. Is Mr. Winters in the chamber? Mr. Winters. Mr. Millner. Mr. Millner. John, you’re the Sponsor of House Bill 1574. Mr. Clerk, what is the status of the Bill?”

"Mr. Millner.” 09300034.doc 10  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"The Gentleman moves for the adoption of the Amendment. Those in favor say ‘aye’; those opposed say ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ it. And the Amendment is adopted. Are there any further Amendments?”

"Put the Bill on the Order of Third Reading. Mr. Granberg, you are the Sponsor of House Bill 1543. Do you wish to call the Bill? The Gentleman indicates he does not wish to call the Bill. Mr. McGuire, you are the Sponsor of House Bill 2968. Do you wish to call the Bill? 2-9-6-8. The Gentleman indicates he does not wish to call the Bill. Mr. Phelps. Mr. Phelps, you are the Sponsor of House Bill 2577. Do you wish to call the Bill? The Gentleman indicates he does not wish to call the Bill. Representative Ryg. Representative Ryg, you are the Sponsor of House Bill 3061. Do you wish to move the Bill? Mr. Turner. Mr. Turner. Mr. Washington. Is Mr. Washington in the chamber? You are the Sponsor of House Bill 277. Mr. Clerk, what is the status of the Bill?”

"Mr. Washington.”

"I’m sorry, I’d like to take it out of the record for the moment. Thank you.”

"Mr. Washington, I’m sorry, could you say that again?”

"Mr. Speaker, I’d like to take it out of the record for right now. Thank you.”

"The Gentleman indicates he does not wish to call the Bill. Representative Yarbrough, you are the Sponsor of House Bill 1352. Do you wish to move the Bill? 1-3-5-2. Clerk advises that there are requests for notes, which have not been filed. Is Mr. Turner on the floor? Mr. Turner? Mr. Winters. Is Mr. Winters on the floor? Representative Coulson, you are the Sponsor of House Bill 414. Do you wish to call the Bill? Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Coulson.”

"The Lady moves for the passage of the Bill. Is there any discussion? There being no discussion, the 09300034.doc 12  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 question is, ‘Shall this Bill pass?’ Those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed by voting ‘no’. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? The Clerk shall take the record. On this question, there are 113 people voting ‘yes’, 0 voting ‘no’. This Bill, having received a Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. Mr. Hartke in the Chair.”

"On page 35 of the Calendar, on Third Reading appears House Bill 414. Representative Coulson. Out of the record. On page 32 of the Calendar, on Second Reading appears House Bill 3486. Representative Bailey. On Second Reading. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Bailey on Floor Amendment #1. Amendment #1.”

"Amendment… House Bill 3486 is the Amendment language requested by the City of Chicago, which provides the evidence and notice that the employers required, under this Bill, must be at least 48 hours. The original Bill does not specify the length of the advanced notice.”

“Is there any discussion on the Amendment? The Chair recognizes Representative Parke.”

"Sponsor will yield." 09300034.doc 13  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"That’s to prevent the victims… some employers had questions about if the victims were lying or being honest or truthful. And by providing proof and documentation to notify the employers that they’re not making the… this up and take advantage of the leave.”

"No, it’s still 25.”

"It’s basically providing that… the previous Ame… did not have a notice where the employee was to notify the employers and provide the documentation, that was omitted. And this also provides that the employers require certification from the employee, prior to allowing the employee the… the time off.”

"No.” 09300034.doc 14  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Yes, Sir.”

"Yes.”

"Thank you.”

"Further discussion? Since no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #1 to House Bill 3486?’ All in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Hold that Bill on the Order of Second Reading. On page 6 of the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 548. Representative Berrios. Representative Berrios. There are Amendments #1 and 2 that have been approved for consideration. Two and three, excuse me. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Feigenholtz on Amendment #2. Representative Berrios will explain Amendment #2.”

"Actually, we need to table Amendment #2 and replace it with Amendment #3 as a Floor Amendment.”

Speaker Madigan: "Amendment #2 is withdrawn. Mr. Clerk, further Amendments?”

"Representative Berrios on Amendment #3.”

"Amendment #3 mirrors Amendment #2 by removing changes to the Structural Pest Control Act. And it also inserts references to pesticides that not only have never been registered with the EPA but also those pesticides for which the registration has been canceled or suspended.”

"Is there any discussion on Floor Amendment #3? Seeing that no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #3 to House Bill 548?’ All in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Third Reading. On page 38 of the Calendar, on… on page 38 on the Calendar, on Third Reading appears House Bill 2890. Mr. Brunsvold. Out of the record. On page 2 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, 09300034.doc 16  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 appears House Bill 9. Representative Capparelli. Out of the record. Mr. Capparelli. Out of the record. On page 13 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2265. Representative Davis. Steve Davis. Out of the record. On page 6 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 486. Representative Flowers. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Flowers on Floor Amendment #1.”

"Mr. Speaker, I think Amendment #1 takes out the Department of Public Aid, was my intent. I don’t re… Oh, Mr. Speaker, thank you very much. Amendment #1 merely clarifies what… what the actual Bill does in regards to procedure. It says, ‘in addition to other procedures authorized by the department under this code.’ And I move for the… the adoption.”

"Is there any discussion on Floor Amendment #1? Seeing that no one seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #1 to House Bill 486?’ All in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Third Reading. On page 9 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 1400, Mr. 09300034.doc 17  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 Fritchey. Mr. Fritchey. Out of the record. On page 8 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 1256, Representative Giles. Representative Giles. Out of the record. On page 8 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 1373, Representative Lyons. Eileen Lyons. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Lyons on Amendment #1.” Lyons, E.: "Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Amendment #1 to House Bill 1373 merely codifies the Supreme Court ruling on depositions used in criminal cases.”

"Is there any discussion on Floor Amendment #1? Seeing that no one seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #1 to House Bill 1373?’ All in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Third Reading. On page 4 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 300, Representative Mathias. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill. It’s Amendment #2.”

"Representative Mathias.”

"Is there any discussion on Floor Amendment #2? Seeing that no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #2 to House Bill 300?’ All those in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Third Reading. On page 24 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2782, Representative Myers. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Third Reading. On page 26 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2996, Representative Pihos. Out of the record. On page 24 on 09300034.doc 19  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2772, Mr. Saviano. Mr. Saviano. Out of the record. On page 2 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 93, Representative Schmitz. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Schmitz on Floor Amendment #1.”

"Is there any discussion on Floor Amendment #1? Seeing that no one seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House pass Floor Amendment #1 to House Bill 93?’ All those in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Third Reading. Representative Saviano, would you like to call that Bill? 2772. Out of the record. On page 3 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 121, Representative Watson. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Watson on Floor Amendment #2.”

"Is there any discussion on Floor Amendment #2? Seeing that no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #2 to House Bill 121?’ All those in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Third Reading. On page 14 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2329, Representative Graham. Amendment #1 has been approved for consideration. Out of the record. On page 6 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 465, Representative Jakobsson. Out of the record. On 09300034.doc 21  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 page 6 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 1088, Representative Jefferson. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

Speaker Hartke: "Representative Jefferson. Representative Franks on the Amendment.”

"Thank you, Mr… thank you, Mr. Speaker. House Amendment #1 changes the mechanism by which court reporters shall be paid. The original Bill provided that court reporters would be paid on a voucher and issued by the chief judge of the circuit out of an appropriation of the comptroller. Under the Amendment, the court reporters will continue to be paid on a voucher issued by the chief judge of the circuit but out of an appropriation to the Supreme Court. This was a… this was clean up language, this was asked for, and it’s an agreed Amendment.”

"Is there any discussion on House Bill… Floor Amendment #1? Seeing that no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #1 to House Bill 1088?’ All those in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Third Reading. Mr. Clerk, what is the status of House Bill 3452?”

"Move that Bill back to the Order of Second Reading for the purpose of an Amendment at the request of a Sponsor. On page 31 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2427, Representative Kelly. Out of the record. On page 31 on the Calendar appears House Bill 3396. Representative McKeon. Out of the record. On page 6 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 520, Mr. Miller. Mr. Miller. Out of the record. On page 5 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 370, Mr. Novak. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Novak on Floor Amendment #2.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. How did you pronounce my name?”

"Novak.”

"Thank you. Thank you. Floor Amendment #2 is just a technical clean up Amendment that the EPA gave us with respect to what fund the fina… the fines will go into. Be more than happy to entertain any questions.” 09300034.doc 23  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Is there any discussion on Floor Amendment #2? Seeing that no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #2 to House Bill 370?’ All those in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Third Reading. On page 27 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 360, Representative Ryg. Representative Ryg. 360. 3-0-6-0. Out of the record. On page 8 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 1251, Representative Slone. Representative Slone. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Slone.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I move to withdraw Amendment… Floor Amendment #1.”

Speaker Hartke: "That Amendment has been approved for consideration.”

"I move to withdraw the Amendment, Mr. Speaker.”

"Withdraw Amendment #1. Third Reading. Are there any further Amendments on that Bill? I forgot to ask.”

"Third Reading. On page 6 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 524, Representative Turner. Mr. Turner. Out of the record. On page 5 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 318, Representative Yarbrough. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Yarbrough on Floor Amendment #1.”

"Okay, I want to substitute Floor Amendment #2 for #1.”

"Excuse me?”

"There’s a Floor Amendment #2.”

"Yes. Well, they both have been approved.”

"I want to get rid of #1.”

Speaker Hartke: "You’d like to withdraw Amendment #1… or table?”

"Table #1.”

"Withdraw Amendment…”

"And substitute 2.”

"Amendment #1 is withdrawn. Mr. Clerk, further Amendments?”

"Representative Yarbrough on Amendment #2.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker and Members of the General Assembly. In working with the opponents on this Bill, there… the Illinois Retail Merchants and the Petroleum Marketers, we entered this House Amendment #2. This Amendment excepts stores that derive 90 percent of the sales from tobacco products, does not allow persons under 18 to enter, and posts the signs stating that no one under 18 is allowed to enter. This Amendment might… allows the tobacco products to be kept in an age-restricted area. The Amendment defines ‘age-restricted area’ as a designated area of establishment which is clearly visible to the cashier that is separate from the other areas of the establishment with a single entrance. I’ll be happy to answer any questions.”

"Is there any discussion on Floor Amendment #2 to House Bill 318? Seeing that no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #2 to House Bill 318?’ All those in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Third Reading. Mr. Clerk, what is the status of House Bill 3493?”

"Move that Bill back to the Order of Second Reading for the purpose of an Amendment at the request of the Sponsor. On page 14, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2329, Representative Graham. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Graham on Floor Amendment #1.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Amendment #1 basically just shells the Bill. This will serve as a vehicle to get the Bill to go to the Senate. Right now we have no idea what the budget will be but this will help keep the issue alive until we know what the budget is, so that we’ll know whether or not we can increase the MAP grant or not.”

"Is there any discussion on Floor Amendment #1? The Chair recognizes Representative Black.”

"The Sponsor will yield."

"Yes.”

"Further discussion? Since no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #1 to House Bill 2329?’ All in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Third Reading. On page 4 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 277, Representative Washington. Mr. Washington. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Washington on Floor Amendment #3.”

"Mr. Speaker, there is not a third Amendment. So, there’s a mi… an error in that. It was just a second Amendment.”

"Representative Washington, number… Amendment Nos. 1 and 2 were adopted in committee. This is Floor Amendment #3.”

"Okay. Mr. Chairman, what this does is replaces everything after the enacting clause and it amends the Deposit of State Moneys Act and the Public Fund Investment Act and provides that the state treasurer and public agencies may consider a financial institution’s commitment 09300034.doc 28  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 to its community when deciding where to deposit state moneys and public funds, effective July 1, 2004. And this is my first Bill, if it means anything to anybody.”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion on Floor Amendment #1. Representative… or, Floor Amendment #3. Mr. Parke.”

"The Sponsor will yield."

"This… this Bill is… is… it doesn’t need any appropriation of any state money to enact.”

"No, Sir.”

"I’m sorry, Representative Parke.”

"I’m sorry, Sir?”

"Well, Sir, I wasn’t aware that the Illinois Credit Union was… was opposed to this Bill. There was no opposition on this Bill. We dealt with all of the oppositions of the bankers.”

"Yeah, the state treasurer is supportive of the Bill. And we’ve taken into consideration of all of those interested parties and made the necessary Amendments to reflect that. The Bill, it just… to give you a small summary, it’s just basically, to receive a deposit of the Illinois State Treasurer a financial institution must be subject to CRA. They must have an overall satisfactory reading and they may show good faith to want to invest in the total State of Illinois, especially in those communities in which these banks do business.”

"Thank you, Representative Parke.”

"Further discussion? Since no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #3 to House Bill 277?’ All in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Third Reading. On page 37 of the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 2316, Mr. Winters. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Winters.”

"Is there any discussion on House Bill 2316? Seeing that no one is seeking recognition exc… the question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 2316?’ All those in favor signify by saying… by voting ‘aye’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Granberg. Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 77 Members voting ‘yes’, 35 Members voting ‘no’, 2 Members voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having received the Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. On page 36 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 1182, Representative Collins. Representative Collins. Out of the record. On page 39 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill… on page 39 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 3589, Representative Feigenholtz. Out of the record. On page 35 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 371, Representative Wirsing. Representative Wirsing. Out of the record, temporarily. On page 38 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 2587, Representative Lou Jones. Representative Jones. Out of the record. On page 37 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 1547, Representative 09300034.doc 31  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 Wait. Mr. Wait. Out of the record. On page 36 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 1272, Mr. Hoffman. Mr. Hoffman. Out of the record. On page 31 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 3386, Mr. Rose. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Rose on Amendment #1.”

"Is there any question or… or discussion on Floor Amendment #1? Seeing that no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #1 to House Bill 3386?’ All those in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Third Reading. Representative Wirsing in the chamber? Representative Jones. Representative Dunkin. 09300034.doc 32  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 Priority #3. On page 3 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 176, Representative Bellock. Representative Bellock. Out of the record. On page 7, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 1208, Representative Acevedo. Representative Acevedo. Out of the record. On page 16 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2522, Representative Berrios. Out of the record. On page 27 on the Order… on page 27 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 3113, Mr. Boland. Out of the record. On page 15 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2450, Mr. Bost. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Third Reading. On page 8 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 1375, Mr. Burke. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Third Reading. On page 38 on the Calen… excuse me. On page 2 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 13, Representative Coulson. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.” 09300034.doc 33  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Third Reading. On page 10 on the Calendar appears House Bill 1577. Representative Mathias. Floor Amendment #1 has been approved for consideration. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Mathias.”

"Is there any discussion on Floor Amendment #1? The Chair recognizes Representative Black.”

"The Sponsor will yield."

"Further discussion? Since no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #1 to House Bill 1577?’ All those in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Third Reading. On page 7 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 1165, Representative Colvin. Representative Colvin. Out of the record. On page 14 on the… on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2313, Mr. Steve Davis. Mr. Davis. Out of the record. On page 25 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2935, Representative Mulligan. Representative Mulligan. Out of the record. On page 31 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 3386, Mr. Rose. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill. Okay, take that Bill out of the record. We’ve done… put that Bill on Third 09300034.doc 36  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 Reading. On page 5 of the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 353, Mr. Sacia. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Third Reading. On page 5 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 429, Mr. Moffitt. Mr. Leitch. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Leitch.”

"Is there any discussion on Floor Amendment #3 to House Bill 429? All those in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?” 09300034.doc 37  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Third Reading. On page 32 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 40… 3479, Mr. Flider. Representative Flider. Out of the record. On page 9 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 1484, Representative Flowers. Out of the record. On page 35, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 259, Mr. Fritchey. 259 on the Order of Second Reading. 259. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill. Excuse me, that Bill’s on Third Reading. Let’s take that out of the record for time being. On page 9 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 1468, Mr. (sic-Ms.) Hamos. Representative Hamos. Out of the record. On page 5 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 343, Representative Jakobsson. Representative Jakobsson. Out of the record. On page 31 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 3440, Representative Joe Lyons. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Lyons on Floor Amendment #1.” Lyons, J.: "Thank you, Speaker, Ladies and Gentlemen of the House. This is… was mentioned by the Clerk addresses the issue of vaccinations in health care facilities. And 09300034.doc 38  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 Floor Amendment #1 basically requires facilities to annually administer flu vaccination to each resident. It changes the age of requirement from age 60 to 65. It makes a couple of additional… the purpose of that, of course, is so Medicare would kick in as far as the coverage eligibility for those 65 and over. It also addresses the issues of… of if there was a shortage of the flu vaccination that they wouldn’t be held at liable. Should the DCFS… immunizations not optional that the department may develop rules to mandate the vaccination and administer the flu shots… I’m sorry. That the… if there was a shortage of the flu shot there would be no liability on the case to the home. And also that the flu shots should only be determined necessary if… if the resi… it would be unnecessary if the resident’s medical history would not… would say that it’s not… not… not needed. So, this addresses two out of the three objections I think that there were to the original Bill as… as passed out of committee.”

"Is there any discussion on Floor Amendment #1 to House Bill 3440? Seeing that no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #1 to House Bill 3440?’ All in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments.”

"Third Reading. On page 18 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2636, Mr. McGuire. Mr. McGuire. Out of the record. On page 14 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2318, Representative O'Brien. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Third Reading. On page 24 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2816, Mr. Phelps. Mr. Phelps. Out of the record. On page 25 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2866, Representative Reitz. Out of the record. On… We’re going to Third Readings now, on third priority. Mr. Brady, you’re up. On page 38 on the Calendar, on Third Reading appears House Bill 3024. Mr. Brady. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Mr. Brady.”

"Is there any discussion on House Bill 3024? Seeing that no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House pass… Representative Lindner.”

"The Sponsor will yield."

"Further discussion? Seeing that no one is seeking recognition, Representative Brady to close.”

"The question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 3024?’ All those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Turner. Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 114 Members voting ‘yes’, 0 voting ‘no’, 0 voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having received the Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. On page 38 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 2863, Mr. McCarthy. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative McCarthy.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Ladies and Gentlemen of the House. House Bill 2863 amends…”

“Excuse me…” 09300034.doc 43  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

“…the Illinois Marriage and Dissolution of Marriage Act…”

"…Mr. McCarthy. Excuse me.”

"Excuse me?”

Speaker Hartke: "Shh… Ladies and Gentlemen, we’re on Third Reading. Please, tone it down. Thank you.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I always appreciate a shush.”

“Shh…”

“The… this Bill does… I… I appreciate shushes from the Chair, not from the Body. The… this Bill amends the Illinois Marriage and Dissolution of Marriage Act. I want to thank my cosponsors, as you can see, I have them from both sides of the aisle. Also, want to thank the Department of Public Aid, Voices for Illinois Children, Metropolitan Family Services, the National Center on Poverty Law, and also the transition committee on child support issues from Governor Blagojevich’s staff. This Bill makes a minor change in the guidelines for the amount of support for the noncustodial parents with two children. It moves it from 25 to 28 percent. While it is just a minor change, it’s been something that’s been floating around the Child Support Committee for about four years, under the direction of Representative Joe Lyons and then under myself for the last two years. I think it’s very necessary and would appreciate your favorable support.”

"Is there any discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Wirsing.” 09300034.doc 44  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"The Sponsor will yield."

"I’m very sorry, Representative. I leaned over and… it… it has to do with the guidelines that are set up for the court. They don’t mandate those guidelines but they set them up and say that for the number of children you have there’s… there’s set guidelines of the person’s disposable income of the noncustodial parent. And they’ve been set at…”

“…20 percent for one child, 25.”

"Correct.”

"Well, because sometimes the court does use the guidelines in the first determinant. And the attorney for the noncustodial parent can go in there an say, well, this is the guideline set up under the Marriage and Dissolution Act. It’s at 25 percent now. I just feel that 28 percent is much more responsible. I still don’t think it’s enough 09300034.doc 45  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 money for the custodial parent, but I… I think a little bit of a change in it is appropriate.”

"Correct.”

"These are guidelines. And this doesn’t change that.”

"Correct.”

"Correct.”

"Yes, Sir.”

"Well, why it is not… I mean, it is not mandated. You are correct on that. But they do use it as a barometer to look at the… the amount of support before they set it. I think 25 is way too low for the two children. I think 28 is more responsible. As far as the break between one child and two, it only goes up 5 percent under the current guidelines; from two to three, it goes up 7 percent.” 09300034.doc 46  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Well…”

"Well, it’s not absolute, you’re correct. But I think because they do… you look at this when they’re setting the… the support guidelines, I think moving it up just makes sense. I think 25 percent is way too low. The 5 percent differential between one child and two child… two children is, I think, very minimal at the least. So, even though… I mean, I don’t think we should go in there because every case is… is different. And what… in some case the judge may say, ‘I’ll stick right to the guidelines.’ And like you said, I’m not trying to take away that discretion. 09300034.doc 47  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 But I think when they just look at the guidelines, I think, it… it kind of stands out in those guidelines that the 25 percent… the 5 percent increase from one child to two children is… is so minimal. And I think as far as the su… the minimum support guidelines, it makes sense to move that the… the line up for two children.”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Lang. I might remind you, there are five people seeking recognition to speak on this Bill. Representative Lang.”

"Thank you. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"The Sponsor will yield."

"Representative, you and I discussed this Bill and I did tell you I would vote for it and I will. But I have an important question, I think it needs to be asked. Does this Bill impact current or… court orders for support that are out there?” 09300034.doc 48  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"This… my belief is this would impact future orders… future guidelines for the court to set.”

"So, is there anything in this Bill, though, that prohibits someone who’s now getting 25 percent, if this Bill were to pass, to go into a court and saying to a judge, ‘hey, they changed the guidelines to 28. Now I want 28.’”

"There’s nothing prohibiting that, but there’s… there’s nothing prohibiting them from today going in and asking for an increase in their support.”

"Well, the problem with that is this, and I would ask you to consider this as it goes to the Senate and maybe talk to your Senate Sponsor about how to deal with this issue. Many times there’s an agreement at a time of the child support award. The… the… the spouses are doing battle and they’re having all kinds of property settlement agreements and custody agreements and they sit down and they work out an agreement and that agreement may have been at 25 percent, based on the formula. It’s conceivable that, if we do this, there’s gonna be thousands of people going to the courthouse to try to move it to 28 percent, which is all well and good except sometimes that’s been based on an agreement between the parties that also runs to custody and it runs to who owns the house and it runs to who gets the golf clubs and all sorts of things. And I think you need to talk about the kind of language that’s necessary to cover some of these problems as the Bill goes to the Senate. Do you… do you see where I’m going here?” 09300034.doc 49  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"I do. And I… I would like to have you confer with the Senate Sponsor, also. And I will definitely recommend that.”

"All right. If I have your word that you’ll deal with this issue over there, you’ll certainly have my vote.”

"Well, and it does not take away the judge’s discretion, you understand that ahead of time?”

"I do understand. But most of the time the judges use the guidelines that are in the Bill.”

"They do. Correct.”

"So I’m just concerned that we’ve had some… thousands of agreements over a long period of time that… that may not just change the child support but could make some of these agreements blow up. And I just want you to pay some consideration to that in the Senate. Thanks.”

"Thank you.”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Rose.”

"The Sponsor will yield."

"Well, there… there are current guidelines, starting with one up to five.”

"Five or more. So this only deals with the two. The two is the one with the smallest increase was and it seemed 09300034.doc 50  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 like, if anything, there’s more of a cost to the family to go from one to two than to go from two to three or three to four. So it puts it a little bit more in line, I believe.”

"It does not in any way.”

"To the Bill.”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Black.”

"To the Bill.”

"Further discussion? The Chair recognizes the Lady from Cook, Representative Mulligan.”

"The Sponsor will yield."

"I’m sorry to say that even with the advice of the counsel I… I don’t know for temporary orders if it would be effective. I know it’ll be effective for permanent orders.”

"But I’d have to back to you and I’m sorry about that.”

“Thank you.”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Mathias, then Lindner.”

"Representative Mathias.”

"The Representative will yield.”

"Well, it could apply to existing cases if people come in for a review, which they have a right to do today. So… so, I would say both.”

"If… if…” 09300034.doc 56  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"If they were granted a modification hearing, yes, they would.”

“They can apply for that now.”

"I’m told here that only if there’s substantial changes in the circumstances will this modification hearing being approved. But everyone… everyone who is under a court order, ya know, can ask for that, even today, without any changes to the… to the floor guidelines.”

"Correct. Or lower.”

"We don’t have a clear answer about the retroactivity of it. I know it works for all future orders. But I would a… a… assume that if someone came in for the modification and they were granted that… you know, truthfully, I look at a lot of these support order when, mostly, women come to my office, I’m appalled at how low they are, not how high they are. So, if this is gonna help them get a change and move up just a couple percent and get ‘em a couple more dollars in order to support their families, I don’t see any negative with that. I mean, I don’t wanna clog up the court system but in the vast majority of these cases that I’ve seen personally the support level is way too low, not too high. So, if this does help them move it up, they go over to modification and say, now the law is 28 percent, I’d be happy that that happened.”

"Correct.”

"I understand your concern. And I… I wo… and this doesn’t change any of the statutes, as far as the reasons for a modification. But I don’t if that’s just a judge’s order or if it’s actually in a statute somewhere, to tell you the truth. But I… I understand your concern. But our thing is when they’re setting these orders… first of all, all the existing orders… it would seem like the only… most of the cases are ‘cause people aren’t paying anything. So, it would only affect people coming in to look for more who are at least getting something today, ya know. So, there’s such a small percentage of them that I think some of the concerns… the main majority of the cases on this there’s still gonna be people who aren’t getting any of their money, not getting… you know, are getting 0 percent. So, while this could affect those who are paying and make ‘em pay a little bit more, I… I don’t have a grave concerns over that.”

"Further discussion? And final questioner, Representative Lindner.”

"The Sponsor will yield."

"Well, it… what it seems like… the different committees that I served on, and some who I mentioned earlier, it seemed like this one step made less sense than the others as far as setting these minimum guidelines. The 20 to 25… like, between 2 and 3 children, the way it is today, there’s a 7 percent move up as far as disposable income. This was between 1 and 2, there’s only a 5 percent. And most of the people who work with us every day said, if anything, it’s of greater cost. There’s… there’s a much different cost between 1 and 2 than there is between 2 and 3 or between 4 and 5. And they just always said whenever they looked at this it just made no sense ‘cause right now 20, 25, then 32. And they thought if anywhere a person needs more income, it’s when you change from 1 to 2, as op… and so, the 5 percent increase just seemed too minimal to them.”

"The Illinois State Bar? I… I… I’m 99 percent sure they put a proponent slip in but I don’t have it listed on my thing here. But I’m… I’m… I would stand to be corrected on that. But I… I… I remember there was some proponent slips. There were no opponent slips, but there were some proponent slips that I hadn’t spoken to ahead of time, the State Bar, I’m sure, was one of ‘em.”

"Further discussion? Since no one is seeking recognition, Representative McCarthy to close.”

"Well, thank you, Mr. Speaker, Ladies and Gentlemen of the House. I think this is justified. I think that the concerns that, you know, some judges made a mistake with seasonal income, that’s a mistake that the judges made. This is a floor that they should look at when they’re setting these guidelines. And I think it is… certainly, if we have a problem in this state, it’s a problem that the custodial parents aren’t getting enough money, not that they’re getting too much money. So, I think this is a… a worthy project and I would appreciate your ‘aye’ vote.”

"The question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 2863?’ All those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk. Mr. Hoffman. Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 106 Members voting ‘yes’, 7 Members voting ‘no’, and 1 Member voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having received the 09300034.doc 61  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. On page 39 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 3620, Representative Dunkin. Mr. Dunkin, you have a Bill… an Amendment pending in Rules. Would you like to move that Bill back to Second? Mr. Clerk, move that Bill back to Second Reading on the Order of… Second Reading for the purpose of an Amendment at the request of the Sponsor. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

“Representative Dunkin, on Amendment #1… Floor Amendment #1. Would you please explain the Amendment.”

“Mr. Speaker, this Bill simply codifies the meetings… the Open Meetings Act. That is, if there is a meeting and it’s recorded, that public body should have it… have a recording of the copy of that particular meeting. It requires that when you have a video or a sound recording is made of a meeting, it’s required… that’s required to be open, then a copy of the recoding must be made available for public for its review.”

“Is there any discussion? Chair recognizes Representative Black on Floor Amendment #1.”

“Sponsor will yield.” 09300034.doc 62  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

“It was with the… it was with the Illinois Press Association, correct.”

“The Illinois… what again?”

“I have not heard from them, Representative.”

“To the Amendment.”

“Representative Black, let me clarify, are you asking for a Roll Call vote on the Amendment? No, okay. 09300034.doc 64  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 Further discussion? Since no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #1 to House Bill 3620?’ All in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

“Third Reading. On page 38 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 2587, Representative Jones. Lou Jones. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Jones.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker and Members of the House. House Bill 2587… amends the Department of Transportation Law of the Civil Administrative Code of Illinois. The department… it establishes, in the State of Illinois, Illinois Transit Ridership and Economic Development Pilot Program. Under the program, it requires that the department, beginning in fiscal year 2004, to fund maximum of eight pilot projects to increase Illinois’ transit service and facilities. And I’ll answer any questions.”

"Is there any discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Black.”

"To the Bill.” 09300034.doc 65  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Further discussion? There are four people seeking recognition: Phelps, Parke, Hamos, and Aguilar. Representative Phelps.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker and Ladies and Gentlemen of the House. To the Bill.”

"To the Bill.”

"I stand in total support of Representative Jones and House Bill 2587. This House Bill will not only expand economic development opportunities in this state but also would benefit rural communities in Illinois, which are in dire need of more transportation alternatives. In my district, Rides Mass Transit, which has the nine most southeastern Illinois counties, would very much benefit from this. Rides has provided crucial transit service for the past 26 years to people from jobs, health care, social services, shopping, and recreation in rural Illinois. Under the Transit Ridership and Economic Development Pilot Project Program, Rides would be able to extend transit services to two counties and enhance service in other three. A commitment to high levels of service will create needed jobs in these areas and provide a viable alternative to transit-dependent workers and families. I ask everyone for an ‘aye’ vote on House Bill 2587. Thank you.”

"Further discussion? The Chair recognizes the Gentleman from Cook, Mr. Parke.”

"Further discussion? The Chair recognizes the Gentleman from Cook, Representative Aguilar.”

"To the Bill.”

"The final speaker, Representative Hamos.”

"Thank you, Speaker, Ladies and Gentlemen. To the Bill.”

"To the Bill.”

"Without repeating any of the good reasons that we should be voting for this Bill, I have served as chair of the Transit Subcommittee for Transportation Committee for the last four years. And the reason that this Bill is so important is because the State of Illinois has never had a plan for exactly these kind of projects that might require innovative routes, new kinds of partnerships, might require public transit agencies to work with employers, to work with social service agencies. That’s what this Bill does. And there is money. The money is going to come down, we already know it, from the Federal Government. There is a program that is coming to Illinois, it came to Illinois four years ago. When it came to Illinois four years ago, it left us flatfooted. We were not ready with a plan, we did not know what to do with the money. It took us several 09300034.doc 70  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 years to get going. This is the… people who worked on this Bill this year have created some consensus about what the plan should be. And then Representative Winters and I cosponsored a Bill that passed last week that would set up the ongoing process for the future. So, this Bill is well thought out, there’s money coming into Illinois, it’s really needed. And I urge your ‘aye’ support.”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? No one is seeking recognition, Representative Jones to close.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Representative Hamos said the exact thing that I was getting ready to say. I have a letter that was sent by Senator Durbin. He was very interested in including job access and reverse commute projects and that money will be from the Federal Government and he has signed onto this. So, I know it costs quite a bit of money but we will be get substantial money… amount of money from the Road Fund and also from the Federal Government. And I ask for an ‘aye’ vote.”

"The question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 2587?’ All those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Flowers and Wirsing. Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 92 Members voting ‘yes’, 2 Members voting ‘no’, 20 Members voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having received the Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. Ladies and Gentlemen, the Chair would like to announce that we are 09300034.doc 71  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 compiling an Agreed Bill List #2. So, you are asked to see your respective chiefs of staff, Mr. O’Conner or Mr. Mapes, if you have a suggestion and a possible candidate for the Agreed Bills List #2. Mr. Wirsing in the chamber? On page 17 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2573, Mr. McAuliffe. Out of the record. On page 3… 35 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 132, Representative Capparelli. Out of the record. On page 38 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 3141, Representative Chapa LaVia. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Chapa LaVia.”

"Thank you, Speaker and Members of the House. House Bill 3141 provides that any full-time employees of the state, a unit of local government, or a school district, instead of just the state, other than an independent contractor, who is a member of the armed forces shall be granted leave from his or her public employment for any period active… actively spent in the military service. This rule also preempts Home run Rules… or powers. Any discussion?”

"Is there any discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Franks.”

"Will the Sponsor yield?”

"The Sponsor will yield.” 09300034.doc 72  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Representative Chapa LaVia, this Bill here, when you say it makes a change, would the change be that it now allows municipal employees to also serve their countries and be able to keep getting paid and having their jobs protected as opposed to just state employees?”

"Yes.”

"Yes. Okay, that would be the main change in this Bill, correct?”

"Correct, my genesis fellow partner.”

"Thank you. I think it’s an outstanding Bill and I’m all for it and encourage everyone to vote ‘yes’.”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion. The Chair recognizes Representative Black.”

"The Sponsor will yield."

"Yes. Yes, it is.”

"This… Representative Black, this just extends to municipal employees. That’s all it’s adding. It’s amending the Bill. Right now, currently, it… the law only allows for full-time state employees who are members of the armed forces to be granted leave from state employment for any period actively spent in the military service. But yes, asking what you asked, yes, it would include that.”

"No.”

"No, we’re not changing it for the teachers. It’s the municipal employees. It doesn’t change anything for the teachers.”

"We’ll… we’ll check into and I’ll get back to you on that.”

"Representative Chapa LaVia, would you like to pull this Bill out of the record ‘til you’ve had time to check that out?”

"Yes.”

"Okay. Take…”

"Yeah, take it out of the record.”

"…that Bill out of the record. On page 38 of the Calendar appears House Bill 21… 3127, Representative Collins. Representative Collins. 3127. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Collins.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Ladies and Gentlemen of the House. This is a real simple Bill. It just amends the… the Bill allows the court to wait… this… this Bill just… because we’ve had problems with prostitution over in the Wicker Park area we’re just amending the code so that the penalty could be in accordance with the 1 thousand feet from school property. So, we ask for an ‘aye’ vote.” 09300034.doc 75  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Is there any discussion? Seeing that no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 3127?’ All those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 114 Members voting ‘yes’, 0 voting ‘no’, 0 voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having received the Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. On page 36 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 539, Representative Currie. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Currie.”

"Thank you, Speaker and Members of the House. This is a simple Bill. It provides that when there are computer geographic systems that have been created by local governments or state agencies, information may be accessible to the press if the information is to be used to protect the safety and health and so forth of the people. I know of no opposition to the Bill and I would appreciate your support. I’d be happy, also, to answer any questions.”

"Is there any discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Lang.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"The Sponsor will yield." 09300034.doc 76  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Thank you. For purpose of legislative intent, Representative, will this Bill make any new records of the General Assembly subject to discloser under FOIA?”

"Thanks for the question, Representative Lang. First, some of the records of the General Assembly, as records of other units of government are already exempt under FOIA. They would remain exempt under this Bill, preliminary drafts, memoranda, and so forth. You might look at Section 71(f) of the Act. To the extent that the General Assembly or any of its agencies or commissions might generate computer geographic information systems, one example that comes to mind would be redistricting data, but preliminary work would continue exempt. Of course, a… a final map that is pub… would be published when voted upon by the commission. But the exemptions that are already a part of the Act would… are not touched by this Bill. The only difference this Bill makes is that for computer geographic systems the press, the media, may access information if it’s relevant to the health and the safety of the people.”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Mulligan.”

"The Sponsor will yield."

"Apparently, many units of local government and some state agencies are collecting data, data that is… may be available to the general public, and they’re putting them 09300034.doc 77  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 in, you know, sort of like geopolitical… geo… geographic positioning systems kinds of things. They’re making it available on maps. Generally, they sell that information to recoup the costs of creating this map system, and that’s okay. And that map is exempt under the current Freedom of Information Act. This Bill says except in the case when the media might want access to part of the map because of a concern about the rights or the safety or the health of the public.”

"That would already be exempt under the current Act. And this Bill does not change that.”

"Further discussion? Since no one is seeking recognition, Representative Currie to close.”

"Appreciate your ‘yes’ votes.”

"The question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 539?’ All those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 114 Members voting ‘yes’, 0 voting ‘no’, and 0 voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having received the Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. Let’s 09300034.doc 78  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 go back to page 38 on the Calendar, on Third Reading appears House Bill 3141, Representative Chapa LaVia. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Chapa LaVia.”

"Back to the Bill. Thank you, Speaker. It does include teachers. However, you know, if we don’t allow these people to go out there and get the basic training and what have you, we wouldn’t have the forces we have in Iraq now. This just helps provide for those mu… municipalities that we didn’t cover before in this Amendment.”

"Is there any discussion? Seeing that no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 3141?’ All those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Hoffman. Have all voted who wish? Mr. Hoffman. Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 113 Members voting ‘yes’, 1 person voting ‘no’, and 0 voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having received the Constitutional Majority, is heredy… hereby declared passed. Mr. Wirsing. On page 38 on the Calendar, on Third Reading appears House Bill 3117, Mr. Wait. Mr. Wait. Mr… Out of the record. On page 39 on the Calendar, appears… on Third Reading appears House Bill 3405, Mr. Washing… Davis. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.” 09300034.doc 79  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Mr. Davis.” Davis, W.: "Thank you, Mr. Speaker, Ladies and Gentlemen of the House. This is a simple Bill which was presented to me by the Illinois Federation of Teachers. The Bill simply amends the Illinois Educational Labor Relations Act to recognize the finance authority as an educational employer. This is a technical Bill to correct a flaw in Senate Bill 912, passed last fall, to take care of the Hazel Crest School District 152½. Hazel Crest School District, like so many other school districts, was put under the authority of an oversight panel due to financial difficulty. Because of the financial distress was so great the State Board of Education sought legislation to place the district under a school finance authority with the powers to run all aspects of the school, this would include negotiating with the exclusive representative or bargaining agent. The original Bill is designed to help other districts that may end up in the same financial distress. However, the language to define the school finance authority as an employer was accidentally left out in Senate Bill 912. House Bill 3405 eliminates the problem.”

"Is there any discussion on House Bill 3405? The Chair recognizes Mr. Black, the Gentleman from Vermilion.” 09300034.doc 80  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"To the Bill.”

"Further discussion? Since no one is seeking recognition, Representative Davis to close.” Davis, W.: "In relation to what the Representative said, I, too, agree that we ultimately have to determine the prop… the appropriate mechanism for funding schools here in the State of Illinois. But until such time as, like the Representative said, the General Assembly has the guts to stand up and make the necessary changes to funding school for… to… to reforming school funding, this simply just allows those districts who are going through that process right now the opportunity for the school finance authority to assume the responsibility of that school district to make sure that all matters are appropriately and correctly done. I ask for an ‘aye’ vote.”

"The question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 3405?’ All those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Saviano. Mr. Wait. Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 75 people voting ‘yes’, 39 people voting ‘no’, and 0 Members voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having received the Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. On page 38 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, 09300034.doc 83  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 appears House Bill 3071, Mr. Delgado. Mr. Delgado. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Delgado.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker and Members of the House. I was pleasantly distracted there. House Bill 3071 does the following. It adds licensed psychologists, licensed clinical social workers and licensed clinical professional counselors to the list of practitioners for whom the IDPA may provide reimbursement for. Also prohibits DPA from requiring physician referral before such services can be abursed… can be reimbursed. This is ba… it’s a simple Bill. Basically says that if you’re a clinical psychologist or you’re a clinical social worker and you’re working for a doctor… they went to school all their lives to get their professions so that they can have their career, too. They’re gonna bill. And right now the only way they can bill is through their medical pr… doctor. And then it’s all done through that one particular office. So, at this point it’s pretty self explanatory. It’s letting the professionals who operate within these communities to be able to file for reimbursement. And in many of our communities we do not have the option or enjoyment of having a psychiatrist located in our communities. Many of us deal with professional social workers, clinical social workers who actually do the real work in our communities and I hope someday we’ll see many offices of others in our 09300034.doc 84  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 communities, too. And for that, I would ask for an ‘aye’ vote.”

"Is there any discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Parke.”

"Further discussion? Since no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House… oh, Representative Black.”

"Further discussion? The Chair recognizes the Lady from Cook, Representative Mulligan.”

"The Sponsor will yield."

"I’m sorry, I didn’t hear the last part.”

"I… I thank you for asking that question. First of all, the… the risk assessments couldn’t be made, the psychometrician would probably be out the door, too, in terms of getting the assessment tool ready and furthermore, we wouldn’t have a complete plan for service, to answer your question directly. But, Representative, also I’m inclined to… to also point of clarification. This is not a new program, this is just adding… the person that’s being billed already has a clinical psycholo… a clinical social worker, be it the doctor. The only thing this Bill will do is just separately bill to that clinical social worker or psychologist. Now, keeping that in mind, right now the previous speaker pointed out that we’re behind in bills. We agree. We’re behind in the bills we’re paying to these workers already. The only distinction here is that the clinical social worker will be able to say, ‘I’m billing mine separately and I won’t get paid on time separately.’ That’s all this Bill does. The fiscal note has been, historically, a high fiscal note. But this is not creating new… new work. All that’s telling IDPA is that you’re gonna get the bill from that worker. It’s happening now but the only way they can collect is through their doctor, the person who employs them. And what we’re suggesting here is that let them bill for their own services, that’s why they have their degrees and a license to practice.”

"That is correct. And even that 9 million, Representative, as you’ve seen in the past, we find that to be astronomical. And when I’ve met with the department they really didn’t have a number and I continue to challenge them and to stop pulling numbers from the air. As you know, we ran this Bill last year and I believe they gave us a $44 million fiscal note. And so where they’re getting these notes to implement a technical change in their payroll process is beyond me.”

"That is correct.”

"And they have no idea. They’ve ga… and we’ve met with them, this is my second turn on this Bill from last year. I’m chairing the Human Services this year, I sat with them and they told us and the Sponsor of the Bill from the National Association of Social Workers that they would get back to us with a number and this is the number they came up with. But the Members… don’t let yourself be fooled at this point. This… these… many of these workers are on line already. They’re working in doctors’ offices, they are doing the job. We are behind in getting their payments. All this will do is separate them and let them 09300034.doc 89  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 legitimately charge as they do now. And in many cases, will charge even less, in many instances.”

"At this point today, they are not… they’re not allowed to get Medicaid. Right now, I think, it’s pro… it’s paid through the provider. No, they… the answer to your question is ‘no’.”

"That is correct.”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Winters.”

"The Sponsor will yield."

"That is correct. In many of our communities, like my district itself, we have many services that are community-based and they do, for example, a lot of the risk assessments for DCFS. Because we don’t have psychiatrists 09300034.doc 90  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 in my community that have offices in my district, they’re on Michigan Avenue. So, many times the community-based ones are agencies that have clinical social workers that are on staff, they’re the ones that actually interview that child who’s been abused and neglected. They’re the ones that interview that delinquent. They’re the ones that provide the counseling. They’re the ones that provide the wraparound services and referral. The day-to-day operation is done in the community.”

"That is correct.”

"They’re paid by that psychiatrist that referred the child to them.”

"No, they do not. Because they’re part of the network, whatever the psychiatrist is charging is exactly what is billed. And then that’s their teammate and that teammate does the work and then when the state pays them it’s not… their name’s not it, it’s paid to that provider. That provider that pays their fee… pays the fee that they’ve all agreed on ahead of time, so there’s no additional fee. No, Sir.” 09300034.doc 91  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"I intelligently assume that’s correct, Representative, because those who are out there are gonna attempt to make as much as they can. And then the la… and then we would think that the provider would know the range from a floor to a ceiling. Under this new provision, of course, that’s… that clinical social worker won’t be able to do that and they’re just gonna bill for their services, which is dictated by… by what we see throughout the state. So, do we get a higher fee? No. Are we gonna get a fee that’s fair, that’s already in place? Yes. Can we see some lower? Absolutely. There is times that they do pro bono and do five kids and they only bill for three.”

“So, the state could actually save some money here.”

"This year’s fiscal note is 9 million by the State of Illinois, matched by 9 million from the Federal Government. The fiscal note, again, as we asked really had no clue ‘cause they’re not sure how much it’ll cost to implemate… 09300034.doc 92  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 implement this technical change from their payroll side. It’s not gonna cost 18 million, Representative. You’ve been around here long enough to know that.”

"Absolutely correct, Sir.”

"Thank you.”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? The final… final questioner, Representative Coulson.”

"That is correct.”

"That is correct. From children to family therapy to group to the individual. Absolutely true. And I think I made that statement in my comments to the previous speaker.” 09300034.doc 93  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Further discussion? Since no one is seeking recognition, Representative Delgado to close.”

"Yes, thank you, Mr. Speaker. I’ll be very brief. Please keep in mind this is not a new program. This is already in place. All we’re doing is respecting the integrity of other professions and their ability to collect from the state, also and to provide these services. They’re doing it already and many communities that have a social economic disadvantage are… are utilizing these services big time. And until we can get our great psychiatrists to come into all of our communities and provide these services, this is definitely a cost-effective and does not interrupt services. And I would ask for your ‘aye’ vote.”

"The question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 3071?’ All those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 89 Members voting ‘yes’, 6 Members voting ‘no’, 19 Members voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having received the Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. Mr. Clerk, what is the status of House Bill 221?”

"Move that Bill to the Order of Second Reading for the purpose of an Amendment at the request of the 09300034.doc 94  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 Sponsor. On page 39 on the Calendar appears… on Third Reading appears House Bill 3628, Representative Dunkin. Mr. Dunkin. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

“Representative Dunkin.”

“Yes, Mr. Speaker. This Bill amends the Open Meetings Act, provides that all meetings required by this Act… that are public… that shall be no more than 30 minutes and public comments are to be at the very beginning of the meeting.”

“Is there any discussion? Seeing that no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 3628?’ All those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk… Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 66 Members voting ‘yes’, 42 Members voting ‘no’, 5 Members voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having received the Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. On page 35 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 371, Mr. Wirsing. Good to see you, Sir. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Mr. Wirsing.” 09300034.doc 95  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Is there any discussion? Seeing that no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 30… 371?’ All those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 114 Members voting ‘yes’, 0 voting ‘no’, and 0 voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having received the Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. On page 37 on the Calendar, on Third Reading appears House Bill 2311, Representative Feigenholtz. Out of the record. On page 37 on the Calendar, on Third Reading appears House Bill 2273, Mr. Holbrook. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill. House Bill 2273.”

"Representative Holbrook.” 09300034.doc 96  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Thank you, Speaker. House Bill 2273 does one change. It… it raises the administrative fee that the percentage that the department can use for their off-road vehicle trail fund. It is 65 now, now it limits them to 85. Testimony from the department says that at this time they are only actually using about 2½ percent for the actual administration of the program and then they’re using about another 7 to 10 percent to hire a law enforcement officer from conservation. So… the intent of this Bill, when it was originally passed a few years ago, was that these user fees that these members pay be used for those off trails and not to be gobbled up by administrative fees. And now that we know what the cost of these programs are, I think this is more than generous to the department so that the money goes what it was intended for, for the users.”

"Further discussion? Is there any discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Feigenholtz.”

"Will the Sponsor yield?"

"The Sponsor will yield."

"Representative Holbrook, I see on the Bill analysis that there are some opponents to this Bill. The Department of Natural Resources is opposed, the Sierra Club is opposed and the Illinois Environmental Council is opposed to this Bill. Can you tell me why?”

"The department wants to use the money for administrative expenses outside this program.”

"So that’s why they’re opposed to it?” 09300034.doc 97  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Yeah, that was the only testimony I heard in committee.”

"And tell me why do we need to… is there a fee increase in here or is this just diverting money…”

"These are the exact amounts that were set originally for the off-road fees for both the license and for the permit. Nothing changed on that at all. The only thing this Bill does is it limits the amount the Department of Natural Resources can use out of that fund for administrative fees. And they testified to actually administer the program takes about 2½ percent. They added to that a law enforcement officer, which ran it up to about 11, I believe. And we’re even agreeing they can use that, even though that law enforcement officer is used in other areas. The group agreed that they would even go along with that to help out the department. But they did want to cap it at 85 percent.”

"What are the… the reasons that we need to divert this money when the department is opposed to it? Why would we… what is off… I mean, don’t we have to make this money up from the General Revenue Fund?”

"No, not at all. No. No. These are private parks financed through this fund at… at operators fees that they’re paying in and those fees aren’t changing. The only thing this Bill does is limit the Department of Natural Resources’ amount of money they can use for administrating the program and they testified in… in committee they’re using about 2½ percent. And what we agreed to is we’d go 09300034.doc 98  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 up 15 percent, that is 85 percent would be… go to the trails. This program was sent in about 4 years ago when we had no idea how this program was gonna be… what type of administrative fees were gonna be charged. And we allowed up to 60 percent when we put the original program in.”

"Well, I… I understand the part of the Bill where you’re establishing a trail fund. And I understand the need or desire to accept dollars from other sources for off-highway vehicle operators. Now, that would be… can you… first of all, can you define what an off-highway vehicle operator is? I seem to remember similar Bills like this sponsored by people in this row back here. I believe that… there was another Representative, whose name I won’t mention, who I believe is your seatmate and my classmate, who had a Bill very similar to this.”

"Don’t forget, I’m your classmate, too.”

"I know, Tom.”

"Don’t ever forget me.”

"So, you know, ca… you know, I have to tell you that… that I think I have the largest number of Sierra Club members in my legislative district. And so, of course, when they… when they decide that they’re opposed to a Bill, Tom, it raises grave concern for me. So, I really want you to tell me, what is off-highway vehicle operators and what is this money gonna be used for? Are these like dirt bikes?” 09300034.doc 99  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"These… these are for ATVs, off-track vehicles, like a four-wheel… four-wheel and three-wheel ATVs. That’s what they’re for. Motorcycles.”

"Four-wheel what?”

"Four-, three-, and two-wheel vehicles, like motorcycles, off… off-trail vehicles.”

"How many of these trails do we have in Illinois?”

"Not near enough. I understand we only have a couple.”

"That’s debatable.”

"No, and as far as Sierra Club and those groups…”

"How much is in the fund right now? I mean, didn’t we raise the fee? Maybe your seatmate can help you with this. I know that…”

"No… no fee… no fee has been changed since the inception. They pay about $30 for the sticker that goes on the bike and then when you get their driver’s li… the motorcycle license, they pay a set fee. And they just testified in committee, right now there’s a… there’s a large surplus in that fund. And I… I can’t remember the exact amount.”

"Right.”

"I didn’t write it down.”

"Why is the environ…”

"Six hundred thousand dollars, I’m told.”

"Why is… but why is IEC and the Sierra Club opposed? Is this bad for the environment?” 09300034.doc 100  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"They… they did not testify in committee at all. I couldn’t tell ya, Sara, why they’d be against it ‘cause these are on private, they’re outside the parks.”

"All right. To the Bill. I just want to…”

"To the Bill.”

"I just want to alert people who have concerns about the environmentalists that my analysis, and I’m… ya know, would be glad to stand corrected, it does say that Sierra Club and the IEC, the Environment Council is opposed to this Bill. So, I caution you in your support of it. Thank you.”

"Further discussion? Representative Stephens. He declines recognition. Representative Holbrook to close.”

"It’s a great Bill. It puts the money in the project where it was supposed to be to start with. I ask for an ‘aye’ vote.”

"The question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 2273?’ All those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk… Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 97 Members voting ‘yes’, 16 Members voting ‘no’, and 0 voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having received the Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. Mr. Mathias, for what reason do you seek recognition?” 09300034.doc 101  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"The Journal will reflect your wishes. On page 37 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 2331, Representative Howard. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Howard.”

"Yes, thank you, Mr. Speaker. My colleagues, up until November 2002…”

"Ladies and Gentlemen, please.”

"…HIV/AIDS testing…”

"Mr. (sic-Ms.) Howard. Representative Howard. Excuse me a minute. Ladies and Gentlemen, we’re on Third Reading. Please hold your voices down a little. Shh… shh. Representative Howard.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker, my colleagues. Up until November 2002 HIV/AIDS testing took up to two weeks from the date of taking the test to receive the test results. On November 7 a new test for HIV/AIDS was approved by FDA. The rapid test prese… presents results within 20 minutes. This Bill requires the Illinois Department of Public Health to adopt rules for the implementation of HIV/AIDS rapid testing. Members of the HIV/AIDS community and public health experts believe rapid testing poses challenges unlike standardized HIV/AIDS testing, which is why we call for new rules under this Bill. HIV/AIDS rapid testing has 09300034.doc 102  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 been proven through a 2002 Center for Disease Control study to have both a high level of sensitivity and specificity. The greatest public health challenge we have today are the thousands of HIV/AIDS positive individuals who are walking around without knowing they are HIV positive. Today’s IDPH guidelines on HIV/AIDS testing can take up to two weeks to receive the result. Many, however, after taking that test never return to the health provider to receive the results. With rapid testing, after one… after one is tested and before receiving results, one can be counseled. I ask you, my colleagues, to give me a positive vote on this measure.”

"Is there any discussion? Seeing no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 2331?’ All those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 114 Members voting ‘yes’, 0 voting ‘no’, and 0 voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having received the Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. On page 39 on the Calendar, on Third Reading appears House Bill 3231, Mr. Joyce. Representative Joyce. Out of the record. On page 37 on the Calendar, on Third Reading appears House Bill 2339, Mr. McKeon. Out of the record. On page 38 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 3086, Mr. Miller. Out of the record. On page 36 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 1171, Representative Molaro. Out of the record. On page 35 of the Calendar, on the 09300034.doc 103  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 386, Mr. Novak. Phil Novak. Out of the record. On page 35 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 136, Representative Soto. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Soto.”

"Thank you, Speaker and Members of the House. House Bill 136 amends the Illinois Vehicle Code. The Bill requires that before ownership in a police vehicle is transferred to an entity, which is not law enforcement agency, the law enforcement agency transferring ownership in a vehicle must remove markings identifying the vehicle as a police vehicle. Amendment 1… 1 was adopted on Friday, March 21. It adds to the Bill a person convicted of violating this section is guilty of a petty offense and will be subject to a fine no less than $5 hundred and not over a thousand dollars. In this section… I’m sorry, and this section does not apply to vehicles bearing indicia of police authority that are not antique vehicles. As defined in the Bill… I’m sorry, in the Section 1-102 and are registered as antique vehicles as provided in the Section. I urge your important vote on this… on this Bill. Thank you.”

"Is there any discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Black.”

"The Sponsor will yield." 09300034.doc 104  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Yes, I am.”

"Yes.”

"Yes, I remember that.”

"I’m not sure.”

"Well, I’m sure that they would probably borrow those cars or rent those cars from an antique dealer.”

"And that excludes…”

"…antique ownership.”

"Only one.”

"Oh, yes. Let me tell you. On three occa…”

"Yes. On three occasions in my district, the 4th District, I was out…”

"Well, you know what? It’s a… dealerships. I guess they’re… somebody’s selling them and they’re getting to the car dealer… used car dealers in my community. And I’ve seen them, I’ve even sent police there. But there is no…”

"It has all the decals in there. So, this is the reason why it gave me the idea to introduce this Bill. It’s a very…”

"I’m sure they do but…”

"Thank you very much.” 09300034.doc 106  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"You know what, I… it was not… the one that I saw it was not a Chicago police car.”

"Thank you.”

"Further discussion? The Chair recognizes the Gentleman from Jackson, Mr. Bost.”

"The Sponsor will yield."

"Well, it’s not the poli…” 09300034.doc 107  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"What… where we found that the cars were being sold was from the Central Management System.”

"So, it was not a police…”

"Correct.”

"Well, it’s a problem…”

"Correct.”

"Representative, I think it’s our responsibility. With everything that’s happening today…”

"Well, they knew that when they… when they were purchasing the vehicle that it shouldn’t have it on there. So, they’re at as much fault to this as anybody else who sells a police car with a decal on it.”

"Not that I know of. What’s happening is they’re being so…”

"Yes, of course.”

"No, no. What would happen…”

"Correct. Correct. What… what happens now is a police… if there’s a car in a lot, in a used car lot, and it has police decals on there, you…”

“…you can call… you can call a…”

“…a police station, they will go there and they will confiscate the car.”

"Correct. Well, that’s what we should be doing. And we’re gonna… this is the reason for the Bill, to make sure that we enforce it. And that’s the reason for the penalty. Because if we don’t put a penalty…”

"Well, it’s happening. So, we just wanna take care of it.”

"Yes, they would be if they were not registered as antique vehicles. At the… it just… if you let… I mean, if you…”

"Well, they would… I’m sure that they would know that they would need to… I’m sure that it’s gonna being brought to their attention that they must have an antique registry.”

"Well, we have an exception in there again regarding antique vehicles.”

"Well, maybe we’ll have a press… of course we would have a press release on… on this Bill once it passed through the 09300034.doc 111  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 House. And we will get that… that out to the press. And to…”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Moffitt.”

"The Sponsor will yield."

"Correct.”

"A car must be at least 20 years old to be… to be a antique vehicle…

"…to be recognized as an antique vehicle.” 09300034.doc 112  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Correct.”

"It’s a logical guess.”

"No, I’m not sure but I can get that information to you.”

"Well, I know… I just want to mention on the record that while my husband has an antique car, it’s a 1963 Lincoln Continental with the suicide doors, and he has registered with the insurance company as an antique vehicle because it’s only used during the summer. And during the cold months he doesn’t even take it out because, of course, he doesn’t want it to get rusty. So, again, I mean, this is when you would have the car registered as an antique when you’re buying your insurance for the car… for the vehicle.”

"I’m sorry, Representative, I couldn’t hear you.”

"Yes, if… if the car has a police decal on there.” 09300034.doc 113  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Can I just say, I know that where I’ve seen police cars with decals on there these are not antique car dealers. There’s a difference. There’s your regular used car dealers and then you have your antique car dealers.”

“Do you know what? And… once it gets to the Senate.”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Stephens. He declines recognition. Representative Delgado for further discussion.”

"Yes, Mr. Speaker. To try and shine a little light on this Bill. In terms of the cars being sold, these are a lot… these are some… for some unscrupulous car dealers that have old, beat up Chevys and they all look like police cars 09300034.doc 114  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 anyway. But they might have an insignia on it, they might’ve left the outside light on it still. Any form of that needs to be dealt with because some buyers actually go to see if they can find a car that looks like a squad car so they can go out and make their runs on the street. And that’s what this… appears to do. It is not intended to… to offend nor to regulate antique car dealers. This is very clear. I believe the technical objections can be handled in the Senate with Amendments and not take away the… the genesis of this Bill. And that is to make… send a strong message to those used car dealers that if they see insignias on those cars, once they’ve purchased them for the consumption of the public, make sure that they remove every insignia that maybe was left behind by mistake. It has no other intention or underlying motive or any conspiracies to do anything else other than that.”

Speaker Hartke: "There’s still three people seeking recognition. The Chair recognizes Representative Acevedo.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. To the Bill.”

"To the Bill.”

"Year after year, here in the House, we pass Bills that deal with crimes against the elderly. Year after year we deal with… we pass Bills that deal with crimes… dealing with crimes against our children. How many times have we read in the Chicago Sun-Times or the Chicago Tribune about police… civilians impersonating police officers? How many times have we read in the Chicago Tribune or the Sun-Times where these impersonators not only take advantage of 09300034.doc 115  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 seniors who are driving but also, in some cases, where have raped women? This is a no-brainer, Ladies and Gentlemen. The Sponsor has agreed to amend it in the Senate. What we’re trying to do… and I… I agree with Representative Bill Black, I didn’t know this either, that they were selling with some kind of insignia on it. And this has to be stopped. We’re putting Bills in that are gonna stop people from impersonating police officers, yet we’re gonna sell vehicles with the… with the mars light and insignia on it. So, I ask for your support of the Bill. The Sponsor has agreed to amend it in the Senate. Thank you.”

"Further discussion? Everyone has declined to speak, Representative Soto to close.”

"Thank you. Thank you, everyone. I consider this Bill a security Bill. I mean, there’s a lot going on right now, you know, throughout the country, we have a war. We have to think that if someone buys a car like this, God forbid that they’d create some kind of terrorism attack. That is what concerned me most and that is the reason why I put this Bill up. Again, this is important not only for my community but also for your community. A car with a decal on there is very dangerous. And you know what? They can travel throughout the State of Illinois so they can show up in your district. So, again, I urge you for your support. It’s a very important Bill. Again, this is a security Bill and I think many of you will agree with me. Again, I urge your support and I appreciate your support. Thank you.” 09300034.doc 116  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"The question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 136?’ All those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 105 Members voting ‘yes’, 8 persons voting ‘no’, 1 person voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having received the Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. May I have your attention, please. Ladies and Gentlemen, it is the Chair’s intention tonight to work ‘til about 6:30, 7:00 on legislation. So, we want to pass as much legislation as possible today. We would appreciate your cooperation. The Chair recognizes Representative Black.”

"State your point.”

"We’ll see. We’ll take that under advisement.”

"The Chair recognizes Representative Mathias.”

"Yes.”

"On page 7 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 1165, Representative Colvin. Representative Colvin. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.” 09300034.doc 117  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Third Reading. On page 9 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 1468, Representative Hamos. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Hamos on Floor Amendment #1.”

"Thank you, Speaker. With us jumping around as much, I’m not quite ready. Hold on one second, please. This is a Bill that deals with creating an energy conservation code for Illinois. And House Amendment #1 responds very much so to the recommendation of the committee when we went to committee that we have a standard language that includes all communities and not preempt… or not exempt any specific community, which is what we had done in the previous Bill. And I ask for your support.”

"Is there any discussion? The Chair recognizes Mr. Novak.”

"Yes, will the Sponsor yield?"

"The Sponsor will yield."

"Representative Hamos, where… where is this building fund coming from? Is there a fund involved in this Amendment?” 09300034.doc 118  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"I’m sorry, I can’t hear you, Mr. Novak.”

"Representative Hamos, is there a fund… I notice on my analysis there is a… there is an Energy Efficiency Building Fund established. Is that correct?”

"No, I don’t… I don’t think there is, Representative Novak. I think that we are looking at the International Energy Efficiency Code for direction and applying it to the municipalities of Illinois.”

"Okay. Can I… I suppose the question I wanted to ask was why Chicago is… Chicago is… their Home Rule is not preempted but all the other communities outside Chicago is. That… that’s not a subject to this Amendment, is it?”

"Well, it is exactly the subject of this Amendment because we are now taking out the Chi… City of Chicago exemption.”

"So, they will be subject to this Bill.”

"And I know that we’re going to be discussing this in full floor debate but this Bill would say that… that any… any communities that already have energy efficiency building standards that are not as… that are stringent… no more stri… no less stringent than what we’re trying to do here would not be specifically exempted.”

"Okay, thank you.”

"Further discussion? Since no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #1 to House Bill 146…8?’ Mr. Meyer, do you have some discussion on this Floor Amendment?” 09300034.doc 119  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"The Sponsor will yield."

"Representative Meyer, this is… this is exactly responsive to your concerns in committee. So, I’m pleased to have a chance to respond to you. What the Bill says is no unit of local government, including any Home Rule unit, shall have the authority to regulate energy efficient building standards in a manner that is less stringent than the provisions contained in this Act. We think there are about 14 different communities that would already qualify but we don’t exempt anybody. We just basically set up a statewide standard and then say that nobody can enact standards that are less stringent than those.”

"I think… you know, as with anything else, Representative Meyer, we’re trying to start somewhere. And where we’re trying to start, pursuant to this Amendment, is 09300034.doc 120  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 with the year 2000 International Energy Code, as amended by 2001. If we ever wanted to change that and have a different minimum standard, we would have to come back to the Legislature and change it for all communities at that point in time.”

"We’re trying to create a minimum standard. We will be discussing this in the full debate. And I know we’ll want to talk about the policy behind a Bill like this. But, yes, we are trying to create a minimum set of standards to get everyone, every community in Illinois up to a certain level for purposes of energy conservation.”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Mulligan on the Amendment.”

"The Sponsor will yield."

"This applies to new construction, residential, commercial and industrial.”

"The… the proof… again, this is part of the third debate… the third floor… the Third Reading debate. But, yes, this is an energy efficiency standard for the State of Illinois. And I know we will want to have a full debate on the value of that but it does apply to new construction, residential, commercial and industrial.”

"A minimum standard.”

"And, again, I… I don’t know whether we should be having this conversation now because I know that there are those very valid questions and I know we’ll want to have an opportunity to explain to all the Members.”

“Thank you.”

"Further discussion? Since no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #1 to House Bill 1468?’ All those in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair… Mr. Black, you’re awful slow on the switch.”

"Further discussion? Mr. Black.”

"State your inquiry.”

"For the Amendment?”

Speaker Hartke: "Wouldn’t that be a question for Third Reading?”

"Again, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #1 to House Bill 1468?’ All those in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Third Reading. On page 39 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 3231, Representative Joyce. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Joyce.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker and Ladies and Gentlemen of the House. House Bill 3231 provides procedure for municipalities located in the counties under 250 thousand people to go after delinquent payers in water service. Appreciate your support and any questions I’d be happy to answer.”

"Is there any discussion on House Bill 3231? Seeing that no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 3231?’ All those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 113 Members voting ‘yes’, 0 voting ‘no’, and 0 voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having received the Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. On 09300034.doc 124  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 page 38 on the Calendar, on Third Reading appears House Bill 3086, Mr. Miller. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Mr. Miller.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker and Ladies and Gentlemen of the House. Today I present to you House Bill 3086. As you have may have noticed, I passed out what exactly tongue splitting is. And what this Bill does is not eliminate it but just makes sure that a physician or a dentist performs this procedure and is performed as… if there is a medical indication for it. I’ll be happy to answer any questions.”

"Is there any discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Millner. Representative Millner. Mr. Bost. The Chair recognizes Representative Bost.”

"The Sponsor will yield."

"Well, that’s a good question. I… I do not know all aspects of dentistry and so, for instance, it may be to… it may be done to remove a tumor of the tongue.”

“So, we want to at least to be able to allow certain procedures may be done or something that I just don’t know about. But hopefully, they would sew it up back to its…” 09300034.doc 125  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Giles.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield for a question?”

"The Sponsor will yield."

"Rep… Representative Miller, help me to understand. I’m looking at this… this picture that you sent around to the Members. I… and maybe the teeth of this individual that I’m looking at… can… can this individual teeth be repaired? Can… can the process be reversed? Because I’m looking at pointed teeth.”

"Well, the pic… the picture demonstrates that someone had… had their teeth filed down to look more reptilian in addition to the… to the tattoos across their face, which gives the scale appearance. Therefore, the… the goal is to look more reptilian. But the answer to the direct question is there can be some restorative teachers… techniques to crowns or composites placed back on the anterior teeth to make it look more human.”

"And so, if I’m reading this correct, the tongue cannot be repaired or sewn back together or…”

"Well, it could…”

"Is that correct?” 09300034.doc 126  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Yeah, it could probably be… the picture reflects the tongue splitting, can probably be sewn back together again. However, usually there would be a scar indicated because of healing between the bifurcation of the tongue.”

"Representative, just what… what would make an individual want to do this?”

"Lack of esteem, I guess. I don’t know.”

"I mean, do we have an idea of how many… how many individuals that we’re talking about today that are actually doing this or… or…”

"Actually, this Bill originated from a… there’ve been reports in Michigan that there have been cult… like a cult members who have done this. I think the… I think the key indication I want Members to understand is the fact that currently they’re going to, like tattoo individuals, to do this. And so, as you can see, this is a lot more aggressive than piercing the tongue. And so you want to at least make sure that it’s in a safe environment done by a professional.”

"Could you tell me what is the average cost of… of a procedure of such, Representative Miller?”

"The cost?”

"Yes. What… what would be… I’m looking at a… a full facial. What would be the average cost of a individual doing something like this?”

"Well, I think that a dentist may charge, I don’t know, a couple hundred maybe to do something like this, maybe more. I honestly don’t know.” 09300034.doc 127  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Is that one of the reasons why you want this to be done by a full professional?”

"No. No, it’s a… in a sense of public safety. I do not have a conflict of interest with this because this is one procedure that I will not be doing in my practice.”

“So, you’re saying that you’re gonna be… that… that you will be voting for it and not ‘present’. Is that correct, Representative?”

"I will be voting in support of this legislation and would hope to add you as a cosponsor, Representative Giles.”

"Thank you, Representative Miller.”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Molaro.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield for a question?”

"The Sponsor will yield."

"I’m looking over your Bill and I see it talks about what we would do as far as penalties to a nonlicensed professional if they did this. I don’t see anywhere in the Bill what it would say what the State of Illinois to do… would do to someone who would actually go in and ask that this procedure be performed on it. Now, I looked at this picture. So, what are we gonna do to someone who actually… these sorry people come in and say, I want this done to me. I want my tongue to look like that picture you showed. What are we gonna do to those people?” 09300034.doc 128  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Well, I mean, anyone could request this procedure done. That’s… that’s… we’re not excluding those individuals. So we can go…”

"So, why not? What are we gonna do to those individuals?”

"Well, that’s just freedom ‘cause what someone wants to do with their own body. I’m not gonna sit here and get into discussion over if somebody wants a tattoo, if somebody wants to have their nose pierced, if somebody wants to dye their hair black, if somebody wants to, you know, do all… fix their nose a certain way. Whatever they may do, this still… the tongue splitting still allows for this procedure to be done but because of the complexity of this we… we wouldn’t want to have at least have some sense of… whoever’s gonna do it has some sense of training in the oral cavity.”

"So, are we… so, this Bill allows someone to do this… there’s no prohibition of someone doing this to themselves?”

"No, no. If they want to do it to themselves, good luck.”

"I think you should amend this later in the Senate and we should do something to somebody who actually wants this done to their own selves. Thank you.”

Speaker Hartke: "Representative Molaro, have you finished? Representative Miller to close.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. You know, many times here in debate we speak with forked tongue and we’re just trying to 09300034.doc 129  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 prevent that so we’re not down in the mouth about this. I would ask for a favorable vote.”

"The question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 3086?’ All those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk… Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 112 Members voting ‘yes’, 0 voting ‘no’, and 1 Member voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having received the Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. On page 37 on the Calendar, on Third Reading appears House Bill 2344, Mr. Washington. Mr. Clerk… Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Mr. Washington.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This… the genesis of this Bill is to give the consumer some leverage being that we’re talking about an industry that makes its… it makes most of its mon… money derived off of information… personal information of people who are consumers in the State of Illinois. So, basically, what we’re saying is that at some point in time everybody should have the right to know what’s in your credit report. And the credit industry should be willing to cooperate with the consumers in the State of Illinois and give them a credit report, if they ask for one, free at the end of the year, of a 12-month period, so you can either update that information or find 09300034.doc 130  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 out if the information is relevant. And that way, one can be able to work on the credit needs of that individual. That’s the genesis of the Bill. And I ask for favorable support of this legislation.”

"Is there any discussion on House Bill 2344? The Chair recognizes Representative Parke.”

"The Sponsor will yield."

"Well, I… I think that’s… that may be easy to say because some people just… you know, Representative, they give an inch. And sometimes when you give an inch you want a mile, but you wanna take, take, take and you never want to give anything back. And I think, once again, being that we’re talking about an industry that basically is in existence due to personal information that is of the individual consumer, is no more than fair for the consumer to be able to give them a little consideration in return in terms of what’s on their report.”

"It’s one time for every 12 months, Rep… that’s not too much to ask for.”

"Well, Representative, that’s… you make my point for me. We’re saying, being that they do make a profit off the information they gather, that they should be in a cooperative spirit to once a year give you back what they have of information for you to be able to review it and see if it’s right or wrong. Six other states already are doing what we’re suggesting here. So, what’s good for the goose, it could be good for the gander.”

"To the Bill.”

"Further discussion? The Chair recognizes the Lady from Cook, Representative Davis.” Davis, M.: "Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"The Sponsor will yield." Davis, M.: "Representative, what is the current Federal Law in reference to credit reporting?”

"I’m sorry. I didn’t hear you, Representative Davis.” Davis, M.: "I said what is the current Federal Law in reference to credit report… reporting.”

"Representative Davis, I really don’t know the answer to that. But let me just add and go back to something that the distinguished Gentleman said over the other aisle. And Representative Parke, I want to remind you that, once again, we’re not trying to force or rearrange the industry that depends on individual information for its livelihood. But we’re saying being that you are unique industry that depend on that livelihood for information, that information must be correct. We live in a age where we talkin’ ‘bout identity theft where the same thing exists for information theft. I know… I don’t know about anybody else here, but I… I’ve been a victim of information that’s been taken and misused by a credit reporting agency where I paid off certain things and, for one reason or another, the exchange of that information didn’t reach the right place. And as a result, as a 09300034.doc 133  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 consumer and a worker who pay taxes, I’ve been denied certain things that I could’ve gotten if the information was correct or if I could’ve had assist… accessibility to the information at least once a year, that I would’ve been able to make the proper correction and would’ve been a even a more happier taxpayer. So, I just wanted to respond to Senator (sic-Representative) Parke, in addition to that.” Davis, M.: "Representative, my understanding is that if you’re turned down by any agency or, you know, if you’re trying to buy something and you’re turned down, then you have the right to a free credit report. Now, does this in any way halt that practice?”

"No, Ma’am. But… but be mindful of this, Ms. Davis, even though you may be extended the courtesy of a free report, it does not necessarily will accurately convey what is accurate in terms of your personal credit history. But if one can evaluate it at the end of the year, then one has a good working knowledge at the beginning of the year of the things that one needs to do or the things that are incorrect. And one has time to salvage that information.” Davis, M.: "So, even though, perhaps… say you were turned down three times from a mortgage company, a furniture company, a clothing store, your credit was denied, you would have a right to those free credit reports based upon Federal Law. And then your law says… your Bill would say you also have one more free report once per year. Is that correct?”

"Well, yes, Ma’am. With… this is like having another bite at the apple. But I think that is a safeguard 09300034.doc 134  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 in the check and balances that represent an opportunity to assess that information, to make sure it’s accurate, and that if one needs to do something one has the time to do so.” Davis, M.: "To the Bill, Mr. Speaker.”

"And if anything is not correct, one has the chance to adjust that.” Davis, M.: "Thank you. Thank you.”

"To the Bill.”

“Thank you.” Davis, M.: "To the Bill, Mr. Speaker. I think in the… in an age in which people are stealing people’s identity and we have so many cases of fraud from the Internet and computer use of credit cards, I think this Bill may serve a lot of people well who have not applied for credit. Perhaps they have not been denied because they have not applied. But they may not even know that someone has placed something on their credit report. I think this Bill deserves a favorable vote.”

"Further discussion? There are still three people seeking recognition. Representatives Franks, Black, and Lyons. The Chair recognizes Representative Franks.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"The Sponsor will yield."

"Mr. Washington, I understand what you’re trying to do with this Bill and I’m looking at the analysis here. Is what you’re trying to accomplish is to make access to credit information easier for the consumer?” 09300034.doc 135  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Yes, Sir.”

"Now, right… right now these credit agencies can charge seven and a half or ten dollars to get a credit report, correct?”

"Yes, Sir. That’s correct.”

"And oftentimes people don’t know what’s in their credit report and it’s… it’s a… and people could get turned down for credit if they don’t know what’s… if there is errors in those credit reports. Would that be correct?”

"Yes, Sir.”

"Now, if… now, if they’re indigent and they can tell the… the credit reporting agencies they don’t have the means to get a report, presently they can get a free one, correct?”

"Correct.”

"But for those people who might not know what’s in their credit report… because oftentimes if you apply for credit… for instance, if you apply for a credit card, they do a credit score on you. And you don’t necessarily know what’s in your credit report, correct?”

"That’s right.”

"Okay. So, what you’re trying to do is to do what six other states have done and what the trend in the country is, is to allow consumers to get one free credit report a year, regardless of their income status. Would that be correct?”

"Correct. Yes, Sir, that’s correct.” 09300034.doc 136  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Okay. I think it’s a very fine Bill, Representative. And I encourage everyone else to vote for this Bill. Thank you.”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Black.”

"To the Bill.”

Speaker Hartke: "The Chair recognizes Representative Lyons. Eileen Lyons.” Lyons, E.: "Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Will the Sponsor yield?"

"The Sponsor will yield." Lyons, E.: "I think the previous speaker has explained a lot of my reservations about this Bill, but there’s one point that I would like to bring up. Representative, in… in this Bill you talk about these agencies being mandated to have their phone number in every phone book serving communities. That is quite broad. I mean, that could include a church directory, it could include a Rotary Club phone book, I mean, I could… I think what you’re requesting is… is extraordinary and I think unnecessary, as well. Would you consider amending this Bill to make sure that you’re… you’re not overreaching as far as the phone book requirements is concerned?” 09300034.doc 139  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Yes, Representative Lyons, I’m sorry that the clarity wasn’t there. I was… I was mostly speaking about the general tool of information that most of us use. You know, everybody’s not in the Rotary Club. But one time or another everybody will use a phone book. And… and being that there are so many different reporting agencies out there, a lot of time people get confused and they don’t know how to get access. And I wanted to… to back up to something that was said earlier. I think the State of Illinois, it has a responsibility to protect its consumer. And being that a number of reporting agencies’ information that is really misinformation, I think a precredit review for most consumers would work to an advantage of that person knowing before they go into any business dealing as to what they will expect rather than information… I know someone had taken my identity a long time ago before it became a identity theft issue, worked under my Social Security number. And when I went to do something else I found out about it. So, I’m saying, I think if we were able to evaluate, at least in a 12-month window, I think it would serve the consumer and would kind of give everybody a little information break as to preview what’s there.” Lyons, E.: "I understand your intentions. But, again, what I think you are asking these credit agencies to do is… is overreaching. Expecting them to publish their number in every single phone book that serves a community, I think, is…” 09300034.doc 140  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Well, I said ‘yes’ to your an… your question. You asked me was there flexibility to amend, the answer was ‘yes’.” Lyons, E.: “So…”

“But then I also clarified that what I was alluding to was not the examples you gave, such as Rotary phone book. Everybody’s not a Rotary member but everybody will have a phone book because everybody has a phone normally would have one. But I’m open for some Amendments in the Senate, as well.” Lyons, E.: "Well, I’m glad to hear that.”

"Yes, Ma’am.” Lyons, E.: "Because as… because that’s only one of my reservations about this legislation. And I would hope that you can tighten that up because I think it is too ov… too far-reaching in that regard. And, again, I would have to ask you what justification you have for limiting the charge to 7.50 when the Federal Law allows for $9. What’s your justification for doing that?”

"I’m sorry, I can’t hear you. I’m…” Lyons, E.: "Your justification for limiting the additional reports to 7.50 when Federal Law allows for the $9.”

"Because I think it’s very acce… excessive. And when you look at the other six states that have adopted this similar legislation it’s in with keeping with the… with the fair rate that consumers can pay for, for their own information. We’re not talking about something that somebody can go out and create. We’re talking about an 09300034.doc 141  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 information base that created by the consumers of the State of Illinois.” Lyons, E.: "Well, again, I… I don’t think that’s justification for that but… because there was a hundred thousand reports issued last year. And you’re saying that regardless of how many are… are requested, that you would limit at that. So, again, that’s another reservation I have about this Bill. What effect will this have on the businesses across the state who deal with these agencies?”

"Representative, I’m sorry. I got distracted for a moment.” Lyons, E.: "What effect will it have on the businesses across the state that deal with these agencies? Who will have to bear the costs?”

"Believe it or not, there’s much too much noise catching me. I can hardly hear the last part of what you’re saying.”

"Shh. Please.” Lyons, E.: "Can you tell me what effect this will have on businesses across the state who deal with these agencies, who are gonna have to bear the costs?”

"Ma’am, it wouldn’t have any effect of businesses at all. What it would do would enrich and enhance the Illinois consumers.” Lyons, E.: "There are 16 hundred employees of TransUnion, alone, how will they be affected?”

"They won’t lose their job, that’s for sure.” 09300034.doc 142  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 Lyons, E.: "Well, I don’t under… how you can make that statement when you realize that…”

"I really can make that statement being a vi… a victim and, hopefully, a beneficiary of this type of legislation. And once again, I am definitely amenable to some Amendments in the Senate.” Lyons, E.: "To the Bill, Mr. Speaker.”

"To the Bill.” Lyons, E.: "I think we have to ad… agree to disagree that this legislation is overreaching, well intended but overreaching. I would support a… a ‘no’ vote.”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Bailey.”

"Mr. Speaker.”

"To the Bill.”

"To the Bill. Just a few weeks ago we passed a Bill here in the House on identity theft that I cosponsored. While I’m down here, in Springfield, a hit came on my credit record and I’m sitting here. Someone purchased a home, built it from the ground up in my name. Someone bought a car in my name and I’m sitting here working on Bills to stop this and while I’m sitting here, someone did something else and used my name. And to say all of this, I don’t think there is enough laws out here that will stop identity theft. And I stand in support of this Bill because we need to do more and more and more. We need all the help we can with identity theft and correcting our credit. Thank you.” 09300034.doc 143  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Further discussion? Since no one is seeking recognition, Representative Washington to close.”

"Mr. Speaker and my distinguished colleague, Ms. Lyons… Representative Lyons. To back up to something you said, I’m very amenable to relaxing or even removing some of the phone book requirements that you spoke of as a courtesy to you. ‘Cause I can understand a little bit where you’re going with that but I’m hoping that my colleague will find this a good Bill to support. Because in the Federal Government, though you can get a free credit report, you generally can only get it at the heels of a negative factor in being denied something. So, with a preevaluation of one’s credit one has an idea of what to expect going in and really can kind of meet those obligations before taking out any big purchases and making sure that that credit and that information is correct. But I thank you.”

"The question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 2344?’ All in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Please record yourselves. Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 44 Members voting ‘no’, 61 Members voting… excuse me, 44 Members voting ‘yes’, 61 Members voting ‘no’, 6 Members voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having failed to reach the Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared lost. On page 09300034.doc 144  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 39 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 3455. Representative Yarbrough. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Yarbrough.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker and Members of the General Assembly. House Bill 3455 raises the asset limit for eligibility to receive home-based services through the Department of Human Services from $10 thousand to $20 thousand. DHS provides home-based services to people under 65 years of age who are at risk of being institutionalized without these services. To be eligible for these services people must re… much… must cer… meet certain income and asset requirements. Currently, only people with less than $10 thousand in assets are eligible to receive such services. Those kind of services are… are like personal hygiene, cleaning, and shopping services. And I’m op… open for any questions. This is also subject to appropriation.”

"Is there any discussion? Seeing no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 3455?’ All those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Hoffman. Representative Pankau. Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 87 Members voting ‘yes’, 4 Members voting ‘no’, and 22 Members 09300034.doc 145  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having received the Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. On page 38 on the Calendar appears House Bill 3058. Representative Pihos. Mr. Clerk… Out of the record. On fourth priority… on page 38 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 2456. Representative Boland. Representative Boland. Out of the record. On page 37 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 2267. Representative Delgado. Representative Delgado. 2267. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Delgado.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. House Bill 2267 does the following. It amends and creates a new offense and provides that a person that commits the offense of paternity fraud when: (1) he or she knowingly alleges that a person is the biological father of a child; and (2) he or she knows that the allegation is false and may result in that person alleged to be the father being adjudicated as the father. This Bill will… for paternity fraud will create a Class A misdemeanor. And I would ask for your ‘aye’ vote.”

"Is there any discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Mulligan.”

"In the Bill, what… what constitutes fraud is if they knowingly and willingly say that this person is the father 09300034.doc 146  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 or mother… in this case, say he’s the father of my child, and knowingly is not. That person is then… would then be charged with… and then proven, would be charged with a fraud. ‘Cause what we’re finding is many folks have been paying child support for years and years and years and, indeed, find out that they were not, indeed, the biological parent. That has thrown their lives into a whirlwind. So, this is knowingly and egregious… in an egregious fashion.”

"Right.”

"That is correct. The latter part is correct. It would not… that is not intended for someone who… who maybe, if it’s through promiscuity or other reasons and can’t identify the dad. That happens many time in cases in DCFS, 09300034.doc 147  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 for example, that there is a punitive parent and is… and someone will name… give a name at the moment of giving birth. But no, it has no intention on doing it. They must knowingly and willingly say… knowing that they’re lying and under oath they’re gonna find out different. This legislation was brought to me, Representative, by… by an attorney of fathers’ rights, Jeff Levine, who is creating legislation to protect fathers’ rights. And this would have to be a clear violation, knowing that they lied.”

"The penalty would be a Class A misdemeanor, I believe.”

"That is correct. There’d be a burden of proof. And, of course, I would intelligently assume, at this point, too, with DNA and with all the paternity testing, witnesses… collateral witnesses. But it’d be clear in that if it’s a child… many of these cases are old cases. And someone’s been rearing someone else’s child for many years because they can financially do so. And the female or male knowingly… all this time knew that they had hoodwinked this individual and unfortunately it happens too many times. So, Mr. Levine brought this legislation to me and since he has a very nationally known reputation for protecting fathers’ rights and custody, this will… this is national legislation actually that would really… what they’re doing is criminalizing the paternity fraud.” 09300034.doc 148  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"And… and being someone who’s worked in the field, Representative, it’s not my intention ever. The best interest of the child is to know who their real parent is. Being, in that case, we should be… we would be helping that child. But I do agree with you, it is… in that aspect of the child would need quite a bit of support. But at the same time that entire family and… and the person who’s been alleged upon, they also go through quite a bit of financially and mentally when they have to realize that as much love and as much money as I’ve given, doesn’t change my love, but it’s not my biological child. We could’ve did this another way. And this is an added protection for those individuals who fall in this category.”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? The Chair recogno… recognizes Representative Lindner.”

"The Sponsor will yield."

"At this point, Representative, I do not know the answer to that question.”

"In regards to a third party, Representative Lindner, I’m not sure what it’s reading in your particular readout there, but the only one that I can think of would be it’s the parent who’s been lied to, the spouse that lied, the third party, I would only intelligently assume, would be a thir… another spouse, a paramour involved. But no, this would involve two individuals, the person that was lied to and the person that lied. And that person can be brought up on charges for lying about paternity and causing undue… undue pain to an individual. If you can help me with what your analysis says ‘cause mine… mine does not say that.”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Flowers, the Lady from Cook.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Representative Delgado, does the State of Illinois recognize common-law marriages?”

"The State of Illinois, to my knowledge, does not recognize common-law marriage.”

"I thought… I thought the State of Illinois do recognize common-law marriage.”

"For separation of property, no they do not, Representative. No, they do not.”

"Okay, thank you.” 09300034.doc 150  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Further…”

"Representative…”

“Yeah.”

“…what if… what if the mother is pregnant with twins and she thought that the other one… maybe the father was one and it ended up being the other? I mean, what if it’s an actual… it’s just a mistake? And then it happened to be one of twins belonged to him and the other twin belonged to the other.”

"Yes, and through the paternity test and through… through your DNA, if this comes… if this… if it didn’t happen 15 years ago, Representative, it happened today, that individual’s very guarded with all the scientists and all the science that we have available to her or he that would be able to prove that beyond a reasonable doubt on that aspect. Many cases are now 20 years old and… and that wasn’t available then. But, again, it would be… the person would have to knowingly lied. In this case…”

"But how…”

"…if she’s mistaken…”

"…but how does one knowingly…”

"Right, if she…”

"How would you prove that I’d knowingly lied. I mean, I actually thought it was you.”

"Yes, and if that’s the case and it’s… and it’s… and they… they really believe it, that will all come out in the process in court. It’s gonna be a pa… there will be a paternity challenge anyway. What this Bill does is say 09300034.doc 151  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 that if you get busted for it you’re gonna have a misdemeanor Class A. If you got busted for it before this law, really nothing could happen to you, although you could be charged with perjury.”

"So, when you talk about the witnesses, who else would be a witness to this other than you and I?”

"Well, it could be your best friend, it could be a science test that you have, that you’ve taken for DNA, your paternity. It’s gonna follow… it’s gonna be a science. Because other than you, the individual, and that person you supposedly had this relationship with are the only two. But the bottom line is that today would be a paternity test to test that child.”

"Well, see my point to you, if there’s a maternity (sic-paternity) test and if the tests say that you’re not the father, you’re just not the father.”

"That is correct.”

"But, you know, if I actually thought that you were the father and now you’re gonna charge me with a Class A misdemeanor because of some witness who said that they thought that I said that you were the father or whatever. You know, to me this is… this is just hearsay legislation. I mean, or that would… that would be hearsay because the proof is in the test. That’s the only proof.”

"Yes, the proof is in the test but then there’s also people who have said… they pick up a phone book and pick the dad out of a phone book and that… and that’s the person they say did it. And many times there may be someone there 09300034.doc 152  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 who shared that with ‘em and there’s documented cases. And… and so if somebody who could be a witness and there’s someone who said I supplied her the phone book.”

"You know what, Representative? I think this Bill here is discriminatory because it’s only applicable to women and so therefore, I would have to graciously ask everyone to please vote ‘no’ on your Bill. Because there’s other ways of proving that… that the woman may have made a mistake because she actually thought the father that she… the person that she thought was the father was the father. It’s an honest mistake.”

"And that… and I agree with you, Representative. And that… and that person would not be caught up in this net. And, again, if they… even without this Bill they could be held for perjury. But we’re also protecting the rights of the men and the individuals that say, ‘but look what happened to me. I paid 15 years. I gave that child… I loved the child. However…”

"Representative…”

"…I need some recourse here.’ And this is a legal remedy that would be available to them.”

"Representative, I think this is a two-way street and there are so many women out there who’ve been trying to get child support and have not been successful in doing so. So…”

"I agree and I support them with all the legislation I work on here, too.”

"Right.” 09300034.doc 153  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"And that’s why you’re right, it is a two-way street. You’re right.”

"Well, let me just ask you this, what about the men who deny maternity (sic-paternity) and then it ended up being that he is the father. How was that applicable?”

"They too would… right… that person, too. Knowingly and willingly.”

"Is that… is that in this legislation, Representative?”

"Yes, it is because it’s he or she. Yes, it is.”

"So if he denied that he’s the father…”

"Yeah, that’s correct.”

"Now, what if he honestly think that he’s not the father?”

"I’m sorry, your last part?”

"What… what if he honestly think that he’s not the father? Why are we trying to make criminals out of people who just happen to not remember?”

"Well, let me give you a hypothetical, Representative. He could be in love with his ex-girl… his girlfriend left him and he doesn’t wanna let her go. And she had another baby and he said, ‘that’s my baby, that’s my baby,’ ‘cause he doesn’t wanna let her go. And he’s gonna lie about it. And that individual can be brought up under this Bill and be charged with a misdemeanor because he just doesn’t wanna admit the fact that she moved on. And that’s… and so he too would fall under this Bill. So that’s why it’s not 09300034.doc 154  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 discriminatory. I do not file discriminatory legislation, Representative.”

"This sound like a case for Jerry Springer, Representative. Thank you.”

"On the contrary…”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Collins. Representative Collins.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Delgado, just a couple questions. Are we talking about married couples or are we talking about single couples? Who are we talking about?”

"No, we’re talking about two individuals. One has said that that is the daddy or that is the momma and one of them… and… and in either case they lied, knowingly, willingly and said I’m gonna get this… this is… I know he can pay for it. For whatever reason it may be collaterally, and I’m going after him. And the bottom line is, all and all knows that someone else is living somewhere else in another state and is the father to that child or the mother to that child. And that is what this goo… this Bill is about.”

"So we’re talking about, like, years later you find out that this is not your child. So we’re not talking about on the onset.”

"Right. Exactly.”

"Because if you’re married you do…”

"You’re right about that.”

"You do know if you are married, automatically, whether you’re the father or not, you’re the father.” 09300034.doc 155  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"That’s correct.”

"And you also know that if you have a child today you can’t sign a father’s name to their birth certificate. The father… unless you are married you have to come to the hospital, after you have the baby, the father has to say, ‘this is my child,’ and then he signs the birth certificate. So, now if he don’t think this is his child, at that point he should probably do a DNA check.”

"That’s…”

"At that point. Not…”

"That’s correct. And you’d be informed of DCFS… are you familiar also with the voluntary paternal signatures that can be given? DCFS… a ton of punitive fathers and they’re in the hospital. We both work for the agency, Representative.”

"But the whole point is…”

"Isn’t that true?”

"…is that if they’re getting child support, most times it’s through the court system. If you go to the court system, I thought… from my understanding from the people that I’ve dealt with, they go to court, they do a DNA test…”

"That’s correct.”

"…and the court decides that they are the father, then they are father.”

"Yes.”

"Now, if you decide on your own, if you are not married, that this is your child then it’s your child. 09300034.doc 156  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 Now, nine times out of ten… you must not watch Jenny Jones and Montel Williams.”

"I don’t watch any of that.”

"Those girls really believe that maybe Eddy is the father of their baby.”

"I believe that.”

"They don’t know.”

"I believe that. I believe that.”

"And then come to find out, after they do a DNA test… and some girls after five times still didn’t know the father so they really, really believe that they’re the father. So… well, so my point is is that I don’t think we should make criminals out of people that, if you’re having a sexual relationship with a person, that it’s a possibility that you may have sex.”

"Right.”

"I think what we should be doing is talking about safe, protective sex.”

"Oh, I agree.”

"That’s what we should be doing.”

"I agree. But…”

"Not making criminals out of people. Because if I slept with five men I would not know who the father of my child was. So it would be one of those five people.”

"I understand, Representative. But you didn’t knowingly.”

"So, and it’s… you said and it’s…”

"You didn’t knowingly.” 09300034.doc 157  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"But that’s my point.”

"You didn’t lie. Because…”

"Five people… you got different partners you don’t know, so each one of ‘em is a possibility because you laid down with them. So that’s my point. So it… it would be impossible… only time you could not name a father… and if that person admits it because he had a relationship with that women. So it is a possibility that he may be the father. And that’s the only thing we can say that if I have sex with a man then there’s a possibility that that person is the father of my child. And otherwise, if I didn’t have sex with him there’s no way he could be the father and there’s no way that that person could be accepted and then in that case, and only in that case, that if you did not have sex with a man then you can say that this person is probably not the father. So if you went around lying and saying, yeah, this person is the father, I may see that. But in any other case…”

"Well, that’s what this Bill…”

"…it’s not possible.”

"Well, that’s what this Bill does, Representative. Exactly what you just said at the end. And… and that’s why… and by the way, if they did lie on the… on the stand, using the same example you just gave me, they’re… they… they perjured. So, you’re criminalize… they’re already criminals because they lied. Now, if they didn’t bring it up with the state’s attorney that’s one thing, but this will guarantee of your party that you’re gonna get them on 09300034.doc 158  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 the other. But really, if I’m the lawyer, I’m gonna get ‘em for lying and I’m gonna get ‘em for lying about this paternity because they’ve injured the child, they’ve injured me, and they’ve made this family in a dysfunctional situation. And that’s why this is a good Bill, Representative.”

"Well, I understand that. But I think the only time you can lie about someone being the father of your child is if you had no sexual relationships with that person.”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Soto. Ladies and Gentlemen, please. Shh. Please. Representative Soto.”

"To the Bill, Speaker. To the Bill.”

"To the Bill.”

"To the Bill. Members of the General Assembly, I’ve been employed by the Cook County State’s Attorneys Office, Child Support Enforcement Division, for the last 20 years. I took a leave to come he… and work in the General Assembly full-time. My experience of working in the courtroom, there’s been many cases where a… the… the mom had named the… the father-to-be of the child… they’ve been on… usually on paternity cases. What has happened is they have named the wrong person. I think that, of course, we all want to represent these moms who have custody of these children. But in the case where the mom’s knowingly is naming someone that is not guilty, that is wrong. I think we all know that. We all have… we all have constituents who might have come to us and have said, ‘Representative, 09300034.doc 159  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 I’m not the father of that child.’ Then you have the arrears… and, you know what, but now we have DNA testing. Now, we’re able to find out if this truly is the father of the child. This is not to hurt someone or… or to make them a criminal, this is… this is… this needs to be fair across the board. If someone wants to be responsible, then we must be there for them. If someone… if naming someone to be the father and they’re not, then you know what, they need to be responsible, too. And if they do something wrong, then you know what, their day will come. What goes around comes around. But I think this is a very good Bill. I just added myself on. Thank you, Representative Delgado. This is a good Bill. Anyone that knows about child support knows it happens a lot. I’ve sat in… I’ve sat in courtrooms where we’ve had trials and then the mom will be under oath and say, knowingly, that she knew that that wasn’t the person, but she had to name someone because the Illinois Department of Public Aid wanted someone’s name. So, that’s the reason why you have this going on. But this will help that a lot. That… this will help the Illinois Department of Public Aid get the… the true father to these children. Again, thank you. This is a good Bill and I urge your support for this Bill. Thank you very much.”

"Further discussion? Representative Molaro and then Representative Black and then we’ll go to conclusion. Representative Molaro.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Would the Sponsor yield for a question?” 09300034.doc 160  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"The Sponsor will yield."

"It… it was a little loud in here.”

“Yes.”

“When Representative Flowers asked you, and… and I don’t know if she asked it directly this way, but obviously we talk about if a woman comes up and says that this man’s the father when she knows he can’t be the father. And so that would make her a criminal, Class A misdemeanor. She would be convicted of a crime.”

"Correct. She’ll be convicted for per… well, she can be convicted for perjury, but yes, under this Bill she’d be convicted for a crime.”

"Right, she’d become a criminal.”

"For paternity fraud.”

"Now, what if the father knows that he could be the father but he says, ‘there’s no way, I never had sex with her’, and he’s a liar. Under your Bill, does that make him a criminal? Under your Bill.”

"No, it does not because of your example, you stated that if he… if he… if he says he knows he’s not the father ‘cause he’s never slept with her and then you want the other side of it saying that he possibly could be?”

"No, he’s gonna… he has slept with her but he goes out and makes a false statement says, ‘I never slept with this woman’, knowing that that’s false. Does he become a criminal under this Bill?”

"Technically, he could, Representative. Under this… under this Bill, technically he could until the DNA’s 09300034.doc 161  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 tested, ‘til the court process is remedied. Yeah, technically he could be. But if… but in this case I would intelligently assume he’s making the allegation.”

"Well, I… I will just take issue with you that he couldn’t be a criminal under this particular Bill. If you read it, there’s just no way. But let me make another point. Let me make some other point. Representative Delgado, here’s… here’s… I understand what you’re doing. I happen to be a male, I don’t want to be falsely accused. But… but let me say this, we, as males, can be falsely accused under 20, 30 different other crimes. We could be… be accused of battery when we didn’t do it. We can be accused of… of theft, when we didn’t do it, by women. So, why would we single out this? Why don’t we say that if someone accuses me of theft when I didn’t do it, when someone accuses me of battery when I didn’t do it, and they know it’s false, we could get ‘em for false report. We could get ‘em for…”

"That’s correct.”

"…for a frivolous lawsuit. Why would we single out paternity? Why don’t we single out these other types of… of… of accusations? Why are we just singling this out?”

"Because… I agree with you. Those are other Bills. This particular Bill…”

"Are you… are you gonna bring those other Bills to the floor?”

"Those other Bills… this particular legislation’s very specific. This is coming from an attorney who does father 09300034.doc 162  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 right to custody, Jeff Levine, who I know you know. And what he’s doing is enha… is buil… creating a law that is protecting many individuals who are finding themselves have paid long-term paternities and then find out that they were never the dad and someone knowingly and willingly lied because they knew that this individual can provide a wonderful life for Johnny or Suzie, knowingly. And that’s all this thing does. Because theoretically, just with the lie, they could be held for perjury. So this is a protective for fathers.”

Speaker Hartke: "Further discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Turner.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and Ladies and Gentlemen of the House. I want to commend the Sponsor for this legislation. I have a constituent who came into my office that we’ve been trying to assist for the last couple of months. And this is the situation that he’s described with. And that is he says that he’s not the paternal father of the child and the mother refuses to come in and do a blood test or a DNA test. This guy has submitted his blood on two occasions and for the last year and a half he’s been paying paternity and he says that the child is not his child and the mother refuses to bring the child in, nor will she come in for the blood test. And so, it’s quite obvious that she’s not telling the truth and I think legislation like this would help in that particular situation. And I rise in support of it.”

"Representative Delgado to close.” 09300034.doc 163  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As such a spirited debate, I am totally awake for the rest of the week. And again, this does not create any two tier, this is a safeguard and for those individuals who are totally being hoodwinked. And I would ask for an ‘aye’ vote.”

"The question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 2267?’ All those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk… Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 81 Members voting ‘yes’, 26 Members voting ‘no’, 5 Members voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having received the Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. On page 38 of the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 3021. Representative Feigenholtz. Representative Feigenholtz. Out of the record. On page 36 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill… Representative Davis, for what reason do you seek recognition?” Davis, S.: "Yes, thank you, Mr. Speaker. Point of personal privilege for the…”

"State your point.” Davis, S.: "…purpose of an announcement.”

"State your announcement.” Davis, S.: "The Associated Firefighters of Illinois are having their reception tonight at the Governor’s Mansion. And they’ve told me that they’re going to extend it until 8 09300034.doc 164  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 o’clock and they want to extend an invitation to all the House Members to make sure they stop by the Governor’s Mansion this evening. Thank you.”

"Thank you. On page 36 on the Calendar, on the Order of Third Reading, appears House Bill 1150. Representative Fritchey. Mr. Fritchey. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

“Representative Fritchey.”

“Thank you, Speaker. House Bill 1150 specifically expands something this Body did several years ago. At some point in time this Body chose it wise to disclose to consumers at ATM terminals that there was gonna be a fee imposed if they used their cards there. What is now happening is that certain fees are being imposed upon consumers by using their debit card when they go to pay at a retail outlet. All this Bill would do is not cap the fee, not the ban the fee, it would simply say that if a fee is going to be charged that a note is to be posted at the terminal that says something along the lines of, ‘Your financial institution may impose a fee for use of this card. Please consult your financial institution for further details.’ I’d be happy to answer any questions.”

“Is there any discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Parke. Mr. Parke.” 09300034.doc 165  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

“Actually, Representative, at… at committee my understanding was that there was no opposition. I really don’t know why there would be… you know, all of the financial industry has said that they want consumers to make an educated choice. They can’t make an informed decision without the information. All we’re saying is this provides them with the information that there may be a fee imposed, if that’s the case. Otherwise, they won’t know this until after the fact.”

“Mr. Parke, have you concluded?”

“Representative Black.”

“The Sponsor will yield."

“A point of sale machine, essentially, is a cash register that you would go to check out at. So, if you are at a, I don’t want to single out any retail outlets, but if you were at a Walgreen’s, an Osco, something along those lines, which is where you would use your debit card.”

“Just for clarification, this isn’t an ATM usage. It’s… Ya know, the banks, for a lot of… for a long time, Representative, said if you want to avoid the ATM fee, just 09300034.doc 166  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 use your card as a debit card and use it to pay much as you would a credit card. And that was fine and it’s good advice and it’s convenient. I’ve… I’ve made the fight in trying to ban these fees. And I’ve seen the light, I think, for now at least. And that’s not this fight. What we’re saying is now that they are starting to charge a fee, it may be a quarter, it may be fifty cents, may be a dollar. If you’re going to charge a fee when somebody goes to check out, just let them know that there may be a fee because otherwise, right now, Bill, you’re not seeing it. You’re being charged a fee and you may find out once you see your bank statement three weeks later.”

“Exactly and if you would ask, the Bill itself simply adds in a couple of words to count debit card transactions. It’s the same Bill that we had put in, actually, prior to my getting here, about notification of fees. At that point, debit cards weren’t included because there were no fees for those cards. Now those fees are starting to come into existence, so we’re simply expanding that provision.”

“Well, that’s just an area I’d prefer not to get into.”

“Further discussion? Since no one is seeking recognition, Representative Fritchey to close.” 09300034.doc 168  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

“I request an ‘aye’ vote. Thank you.”

“The question is, ‘Shall the House pass House Bill 1150?’ All those in favor signify by voting ‘yes’; those opposed vote ‘no’. The voting is open. Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Have all voted who wish? Mr. Clerk, take the record. On this question, there are 108… 9 Member… 109 Members voting ‘yes’, 0 voting ‘no’, and 4 Members voting ‘present’. And this Bill, having received the Constitutional Majority, is hereby declared passed. On page 15 of the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2391. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Leave that Bill on Second Reading. On page 9 on the Calendar, on Second Reading appears House Bill 1414. Representative Pankau. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Third Reading. On page 9 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 1451. Representative Brosnahan. Mr. Clerk… Out of the record. On page 33 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 3671. Representative Davis, Willy 09300034.doc 169  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 Davis. Out of the record. On page 5 of the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 344. Representative Jakobsson, Naomi Jakobsson. Mr. Clerk, out of the record. On page 27 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 3062. Representative Jones, Lou Jones. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Third Reading. On page 32 of the Calendar appears House Bill 3527. Representative Joyce. Out of the record. On page 31 on the Calendar appears House Bill 3398. Representative McGuire. Out of the record. On page 17 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2567. Representative Mendoza. Representative Mendoza. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Mendoza on Amendment #1. On Amendment #1.”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. House Amendment #1 makes a very quick and simple change to the original Bill. Says that each appeal shall be limited to the grounds listed in the petition filed with the Property Tax Board of Appeals. The original Bill just asks that the Property Tax Board of 09300034.doc 170  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 Appeals give information to the counties and different municipalities regarding how many… information regarding assessments that are made. And… and… it’s just a technical Amendment to the original Bill.”

"Is there any discussion? Seeing that no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #1 to House Bill 2567?’ All those in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Third Reading. On page 16 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2526. Representative Osterman. Out of the record. On page 10 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 1518. Representative Phelps. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Third Reading. On page 27 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 3078. Representative Reitz. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Third Reading. On page 4 on the Calendar appears House Bill 2020. Representative Slone. Representative Slone. 220. Out of the record. Representative Slone, do you wanna call that Bill? So, it’s Second Reading, move it to Third? Out of the record. On page 18 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2601. Representative Wyvetter Younge. Representative Younge. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Third Reading. On page 33 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 3671. Representative Davis. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Third Reading. On page 3 on the Calendar is House Bill 197. Representative Davis. Mr… Monique Davis. Mr. Clerk, read the… Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

Speaker Hartke: "Third Reading. Oh, oh, the Amendment. Representative Davis on the Amendment.” Davis, M.: "Thank you very much. I wish you would just pass it like that. I like that very much. The Amendment rea… merely says that screening of pregnant or lactating women should be made available, subject to appropriations, that the depart… excuse me, the department shall establish a program to provide lead poisoning screening for women who are determined to reside in an area defined as high risk by the department, age 13 or older and either pregnant or lactating. And that’s all the Amendment says.”

"Is there any discussion? The Chair recognizes Representative Fritchey.”

"Speaker, on a point of personal privilege. At the request of Chairman Saviano, the Registration Regulation Committee hearing tomorrow is going to be canceled, as we have no subjects before the committee.”

"Okay, thank you. Is there any discussion on the Amendment? Seeing that no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #1 to House Bill… Representative Kosel.”

"The question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #1 to House Bill 197?’ All those in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Third Reading. On page 5 on the Calendar, on Second Reading appears House Bill 429. On page 3 on the Calendar, on House Bills-Second Reading, appears House Bill 115. Representative Moffitt. Mr. Moffitt. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Representative Moffitt on Floor Amendment #2.”

"Is there any discussion on Floor Amendment #2? Seeing that no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #2 to House Bill 115?’ All those in favor signify by saying ‘yes’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Third Reading. On page 7 on the Calendar, on Second Reading appears House Bill 1161. Representative Winters. Mr. Winters. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

"Mr. Winters on Amendment #2.” 09300034.doc 175  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003

Speaker Hartke: "Is there any discussion on the Amendment? Seeing no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #2 House Bill 1161?’ All those in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Third Reading. On page 4 of the Calendar, on House Bill… on Second Reading appears House Bill 310. Representative Mendoza. Representative Mendoza. Out of the record. On page 18 on the Calendar, on the Order of Second Reading, appears House Bill 2598. Representative Younge. Wyvetter Younge. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill. Representative Younge. Out of the record. On page 9 of the Calendar, on Second Reading appears House Bill 1400. Mr. Fritchey. Mr. Clerk, read the Bill.”

Speaker Hartke: "Representative Fritchey on Floor Amendment #1.”

"Thank you, Speaker. Floor Amendment 1 really cleans up and strengthens the underlying Bill. It was the 09300034.doc 176  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 initiative of the Cook County State’s Attorneys Office. I’d be happy to answer any questions.”

"Is there any discussion on Floor Amendment #1? Seeing no one is seeking recognition, the question is, ‘Shall the House adopt Floor Amendment #1 to House Bill 1400?’ All those in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have. And the Amendment is adopted. Further Amendments?”

"Third Reading. Representative Bost, for what reason do you seek recognition?”

"State your inquiry.”

"No.”

“The Clerk for an announcement.”

"Representative Howard, for what reason do you seek recognition?”

"Yes, Mr… Mr. Speaker. I just wanted to make certain that all of my colleagues did receive a… an invitation to a break… breakfast tomorrow morning from the Alpha Kappa 09300034.doc 177  STATE OF ILLINOIS 93rd GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES TRANSCRIPTION DEBATE 34th Legislative Day 3/25/2003 Alpha Sorority women who will be in town. Everybody’s invited. It’s going to be at 7:30 at the YWCA. I look forward to seeing you all.”

"Representative Giles, for what reason do you seek recognition?”

"Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Members of the Elementary & Secondary Education Committee, in Room 118, instead of meeting at 8:30 a… a.m. we will meet at 10:30 a.m. in that same room. That is enough time to do the business of the people.”

Speaker Hartke: "Representative Giles, please approach the podium. Representative Currie now moves that the House stand adjourned, allowing perfunctory time for the Clerk, ‘til the hour of 11 a.m., Wednesday, March 26, 11 a.m. All those in favor signify by saying ‘aye’; opposed ‘no’. In the opinion of the Chair, the ‘ayes’ have it. And the House stands adjourned until 11 a.m.”